Spectropop - Digest Number 1483

• From: Spectropop Group
• Date: Sat, 15 May 2004

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               SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
________________________________________________________________________


There are 17 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: Jordan Bros
           From: Dave O'Gara 
      2. Re: Reading music
           From: Steve Harvey 
      3. Wishful Linking.
           From: Steve Harvey 
      4. Jerry Ganey
           From: Gary Myers 
      5. Re: Buying reissue CDs
           From: superoldies 
      6. Re: Reading music
           From: Joe Nelson 
      7. Rick Lancelot and Estelle Bennett
           From: Sean 
      8. Re: Reading music
           From: Gary Myers 
      9. Four Tops / Knickerbockers
           From: Mick Patrick 
     10. Re: EMI stereo
           From: Wes Smith 
     11. Re: Projection location
           From: Al Kooper 
     12. Re: Buying reissue CDs
           From: Frank Jastfelder 
     13. Re: Les Scopitones
           From: Frank Jastfelder 
     14. The Sands Of Time
           From: S'pop Team 
     15. Re: Help Me R(h)onda
           From: Richard Hattersley 
     16. Marketts on TV
           From: Frank Jastfelder 
     17. Re: Four Tops
           From: Martin Jensen 


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Message: 1
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 14:57:49 -0000
   From: Dave O'Gara 
Subject: Re: Jordan Bros

Country Paul wrote: 
> I checked out www.thejordanbrothers.com as recommended by Al Q. 
> "Heart" audio comes up on the main page (they say it wasn't a 45, 
> but why is the song so familiar?) "The Things I Didn't Say" is 
> also sampled (good record), and there claims to be a link to a 
> sample of "Gimme Some Lovin'" (#3 in Boston, it claims), but it 
> wouldn't open. I just may spring for the Greatest Hits CD....

The song Heart that sounds familiar to you charted in 1963 by Kenny 
Chandler, on Laurie Records I believe. A very popular record here in 
central Massachusetts. The clip of the Jordan Brothers singing that 
song is very faithful to the Chandler version. (By the way, Does 
anyone have any info on Kenny Chandler? What else did he do and is he 
still in the business?)...................... Regarding Gimme Some 
Lovin', it did indeed chart top ten on WBZ-AM in Boston and other New 
England radio stations..and I agree their song samples sound 
intriguing. I had only been familiar with Gimme Some Lovin' so I 
may "spring" for the CD also.

Dave 0'



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Message: 2
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 09:39:01 -0700 (PDT)
   From: Steve Harvey 
Subject: Re: Reading music

Will Stos wrote:
> Here's a question for some experts: I've read a lot 
> of profiles on session singers who cut demos, only 
> to have other performers cover them faithfully and 
> have hits (ie. the Chiffons over-dubbing Little Eva 
> on "One Fine Day," or Valerie Simpson cutting records 
> for Diana Ross' early solo material). Was this very 
> common? 

Copycatting was not that unknown back in the day. If you 
wanted to have an artist cover your tune you tried to 
come up with a demo that sounded as close to their style. 
Otis Blackwell often emulated Elvis's records in order to 
pitch his tunes to the Big E. It worked, judging from the 
number of tunes Elvis covered that were Otis's tunes. I 
don't think it had much to do with whether an artist 
could read music or not. The less work you made for an 
artist the more likely they were to cover your tunes.

Sometimes marketing had something to do with who got the 
record out. Huey Piano Smith and the Clowns did "Sea 
Cruise", but the label figured a white artist had a 
greater chance at a hit and wiped out the vocal track. In 
comes Frankie Ford and the hit is now remembered as one of 
his tunes. 

How about Darlene Love doing "He's a Rebel" only to have 
it come out under the Crystals name? Was it a matter of 
getting the tunes out in time to beat out Vicki Carr's 
version or the fact that the Crystals had more name 
recognition than Darlene?



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Message: 3
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 09:42:53 -0700 (PDT)
   From: Steve Harvey 
Subject: Wishful Linking.

Mick Patrick wrote:
> The Knickerbockers' "Wishful Thinking" is one fabulous 
> record, if you like Spectoresque Righteous Brothers-style
> epics, which I do. 

When I first picked up the Knickerbockers lp with "Lies" it 
was "Wishful Thinking" that really stood out. It wasn't much 
of a surprise to find out later that the singer was Bill 
Medley's replacement in the Brothers when Bill went solo.



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Message: 4
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 10:35:19 -0700
   From: Gary Myers 
Subject: Jerry Ganey

Mick Patrick:
>  ... back to my new Jerry Ganey 45 ... 

Hey, I know him! Jerry Gee (Ganey) & the Rousers followed us into 
a club in South Gate (CA) around '65 - '66, and then at some point 
we were both at that club, alternating sets - probably for a week 
or two. Then, once around the late 70's (I think), I auditioned 
for a gig with them, and then, sometimes around the late 80's, I 
came across him, still playing clubs, in the South Bay area here, 
which is where I think he was based all the time. I also remember 
him doing a local TV show with one of his releases, probably around 
late 60's. I've also run across the sax player (Rudy something) 
from the Rousers a couple of times since the 60's.

And, speaking of the Knickerbockers, we did their off-night at the 
Red Velvet in Hollywood for a few weeks, shortly before "Lies", but 
I think I've already mentioned that in here several weeks ago.

gem



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Message: 5
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 17:10:42 -0000
   From: superoldies 
Subject: Re: Buying reissue CDs

The SLOWEST service I've found of all of the mail-order/reissue 
companies is Collectables. Unless you get their $7.50 1st class 
service expect the CDs to take their 14 days.




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Message: 6
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 16:28:09 -0400
   From: Joe Nelson 
Subject: Re: Reading music

Will Stos wrote:
> Here's a question for some experts: I've read a lot 
> of profiles on session singers who cut demos, only 
> to have other performers cover them faithfully and 
> have hits (ie. the Chiffons over-dubbing Little Eva 
> on "One Fine Day," or Valerie Simpson cutting records 
> for Diana Ross' early solo material). Was this very 
> common? 

It's fairly common. I'd say most rock artists are either unable to
read music or generally don't, since it's a genre that bases itself
mainly on the feel of the moment. Being able to copy the demo exactly
is more a matter of memorization than anything else.

About a week and a half ago, a local radio station did a contest that
parodied American Idol. One girl was in the studio, singing Mariah
Carey's "Love Takes Time". She sang it perfectly - but it was note-
for-note faithful to the CD. I was thinking "yeah, but what does this 
have to do with you? Stripped down to the basic melody without any 
grace notes, what would you do to that melody to make it yours?

Elvis Presley tended to copy his demos exactly, yet could reinterpret
with the best of them. I'd say the general answer to your question is
this: in a genre where most performers know little about the mechanics
of music, it's harder to ignore your ears and use your mind than it is
to depend on your ears and do what you're told.

Joe Nelson



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Message: 7
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 22:15:42 -0000
   From: Sean 
Subject: Rick Lancelot and Estelle Bennett

What  happened to these two? I saw a few of Rick Lancelot's singles 
on the web but it says that they are promotional copies so they were 
probably never released. And he recorded under 20th Century, some of 
his songs were "Heartbreak Train" "That's My Bag" and "For You". I 
also have seen him on Shindig! and Shivaree. Now with Estelle she was 
in the Ronettes, only on a few songs but still was a Ronette. Anyone 
know what these two are doing?




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Message: 8
   Date: Sat, 15 May 2004 11:27:07 -0700
   From: Gary Myers 
Subject: Re: Reading music

Will Stos:
> I've read a lot of profiles on session singers who cut demos, 
> only to have other performers cover them faithfully and have 
> hits ... Was this very common?

I would say yes.

> ... was this done with performers who couldn't sight-read music, 
> or read music altogether? Does anyone know of performers who can 
> only learn by ear?

>From my own standpoint, although I know a lot about music (played 
professionally since 1960, a few different instruments, & I'm the 
author of a chord book), my sight reading sucks and I would MUCH 
rather learn something by ear than to read it. I think it's a safe 
bet that most pop/rock singers who are not known for playing an 
instrument (and probably some who are) are probably not good 
readers.

gem



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Message: 9
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 10:12:10 +0100
   From: Mick Patrick 
Subject: Four Tops / Knickerbockers

Me:
> The Knickerbockers' "Wishful Thinking" is one fabulous record, 
> if you like Spectoresque Righteous Brothers-style epics, which 
> I do. I only have the track on CD. Some of you have it on vinyl, 
> I'm sure. I'm hoping a producer and/or arranger gets a label 
> credit. Do tell. Thanks.

Jeffrey Mlinscek:
> Here is the lowdown.
> Arranged by Leon Russell
> Produced by Jerry Fuller
> Written by Wynn Stewart

Thanks for the info, Jeffrey. Leon Russell and Jerry Fuller, eh?
No wonder it's so good.

Talking of Spector soundalikes... Could someone please tell me 
who produced the Four Tops' "Wonderful Baby". It was the B-side 
of their version of "If I Were A Carpenter". Alas, I don't have 
that 45. Thanking you.

Hey la,

Mick Patrick



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Message: 10
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 03:05:31 -0000
   From: Wes Smith 
Subject: Re: EMI stereo

Mikey wrote:
> George Martin did The Beatles that way because he wanted the option 
> of compressing the vocals or instruments independently, to get a
> harder sound. With Cliff and the Shads, the sound was more 
> orchestrated, rather than pure rock like The Beatles, and lent 
> itself better to true stereo mixes. I love the Shads in stereo.
> That's one band and one instance where nobody can say the mono
> sounds better -- it doesn't. The Shads in stereo is a fantastic 
> listening experience. Listen to the stereo Wonderful Land with the 
> strings -- it doesn't get better than that.

Mikey...I positively echo your thoughts on "WONDERFUL LAND". One of 
the best instrumentals I've ever heard(and I love a few hundred of 
them).

Wes Smith
P.S.---And yes, the super stereo really brings it out even moreso.



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Message: 11
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 05:54:05 EDT
   From: Al Kooper 
Subject: Re: Projection location

> I always loved that Blues Project photo with the members posed 
> behind one of those playground climbing things. Just looks like 
> a natural setting (foredrop?) for a band photo.

> In fact, the playground in my apartment complex has one of those 
> and I've long been tempted to have my picture taken peering from 
> behind it, ala the Project. If I ever started a band, it would 
> definitely be utilized.

Now THAT was shot in the West Village. The exact spot escapes me.

AK



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Message: 12
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 14:03:11 +0200
   From: Frank Jastfelder 
Subject: Re: Buying reissue CDs

Michael Godin:
> I find Collectors Choice Music to be very helpful myself. I have
> been buying from them for over five years, and have always been
> found their service, delivery and prices to my satisfaction.

James Botticelli:
> I find their delivery incredibly slow which is why they are always
> my last resort...the websites pump 'em out quick...

Al Kooper:
> uhhhh...Collector's Choice has a website.... They're slower than 
> Donald Rumsfield owning up.

I try to avoid to buy anything by Collectors Choice. I have a 
Christmas compilation with absolutely no credits to songwriters, 
publishers or production dates. Besides their reissue artworks are 
hideous most of the time.

Frank



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Message: 13
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 15:11:15 +0200
   From: Frank Jastfelder 
Subject: Re: Les Scopitones

Phil M:
> Scopitones on DVD, at http://scopitones.com   Grey market. I haven't 
> seen any of these transfers (yet!), but am told they are excellent.

Thanks for the link. Very interesting site. I´ve watched the scopitone 
of the day. The quality seems to be quite okay. plus 20 bucks is fair 
for a dvd with 20 songs.



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Message: 14
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 10:23:41 +0100
   From: S'pop Team 
Subject: The Sands Of Time

Plucked from the S'pop Public Bulletin Board:

Does anyone have info on Tony Hatch-produced group the Sands Of 
Time and their 1967 song "Where Did We Go Wrong" on Pye Records? 
I think this was only released in England, and they are not the 
North American group of the same name.



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Message: 15
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 15:02:38 +0000
   From: Richard Hattersley 
Subject: Re: Help Me R(h)onda

Charles Ulrich wrote:
> And then there was the theme from It's Gary Shandling's Show,
> which was apparently based on the guitar lick from "Help Me,
> Rhonda".

Steve Harvey reckoned:
> It's actually a uke, not a guitar that plays the signature lick.

I think it's guitar on Help Me Rhonda but ukelele on Help Me Ronda.

Richard
www.wiz.to/richardsnow



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Message: 16
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 15:08:30 +0200
   From: Frank Jastfelder 
Subject: Marketts on TV

I've seen that The Marketts appeared on two episodes of Where The 
Action Is in 1966. Does anyone of you 'poppers have a clue if they 
appeared there in person and if so, who these persons were (since 
the group consisted of studio musicians as far as I know)??? 
Appreciate any help on this.

Frankman



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Message: 17
   Date: Sun, 16 May 2004 14:57:00 -0000
   From: Martin Jensen 
Subject: Re: Four Tops

Mick Patrick wrote:
> Talking of Spector soundalikes... Could someone please tell me 
> who produced the Four Tops' "Wonderful Baby". It was the B-side 
> of their version of "If I Were A Carpenter". Alas, I don't have 
> that 45. Thanking you.

I have the "Four Tops - Until You Love Someone, more of the best 
(1965-1970)" CD comp issued by Rhino in 93. According to the booklet 
Smokey Robinson both wrote and produced 'Wonderful Baby'. Killer 
song by the way!

with regards
Martin, Denmark



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