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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Robert John / Bobby (Pedrick, Jr.) & the Consoles
From: Austin Roberts
2. Re: Sie Liebt Dich
From: Mike Page
3. Dionne Warwick
From: Norm D. Plume
4. Re: Beatles recordings abroad
From: Lloyd Davis
5. Re: Beach Music
From: James Botticelli
6. Re: Don Thomas / Dave Berry / Sex Pistols
From: Joe Foster
7. Don't Give Me No Lip Child - Don Thomas??
From: Ian Slater
8. Re: Diamond Records Masters
From: Tom
9. Re:Beach Music
From: Howard Earnshaw
10. Re: Don't Give Me No Lip Child - Don Thomas?? / Associated Studios
From: Mike Rashkow
11. Re: Beach Music
From: Mikey
12. Brill Bldg. inquiry
From: XmidX
13. "Too Young To Be A Widow"
From: Andrew C Jones
14. Re: Sonny Curtis / 4-track Stax / Where Were You
From: Al Kooper
15. Blonde On Blonde bash / Diamond masters / pirate air
From: Al Kooper
16. Re: Ronnie Dove
From: Joe Nelson
17. Re: Don Thomas
From: Ed B
18. As The Crow Flies & The Magic Lantern
From: max weiner
19. Re: Robert John / Bobby (Pedrick, Jr.) & The Consoles
From: Fred Clemens
20. Re: Beach Music / The Embers
From: Steve Jarrell
21. Dobie Gray on White Whale
From: Clark Besch
22. Re: Don (& Jean) Thomas
From: Mike Rashkow
23. Re: As The Crow Flies & The Magic Lantern
From: Clark Besch
24. Re: Blonde On Blonde bash
From: Austin Roberts
25. Crow
From: Gary Myers
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Message: 1
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 06:27:33 EDT
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Robert John / Bobby (Pedrick, Jr.) & the Consoles
Hi Fred, I think Bobby Pedrick's (pre Robert John) first single of
any consequence, and Al, you can correct me on this, was White Bucks
or White Buck Shoes or something like that, when he was 13.
Austin (wouldn't be caught dead in White Buck Shoes) Roberts
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 09:14:24 +0100
From: Mike Page
Subject: Re: Sie Liebt Dich
Eddy wrote:
> Except for its appearance on the Swan 45, Sie liebt dich remained
> unreleased in both UK and USA until the Rarities LP's.
Steve Harvey:
> Not quite, it's on Past Masters Vol. 1.
Eddy:
> Past Masters appeared AFTER the Rarities LP's, didn't it... (1979/
> 1980 vs 1988).
Yes it did. The rarities album was originally released as part of a
boxed set of all of the Beatles albums, and then as a separate issue.
Past Masters was one of the CD releases of Beatles material.
Mike
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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 00:38:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Norm D. Plume
Subject: Dionne Warwick
Bill George wrote:
> And from what I hear, Dionne (Warwick) can't sing anymore. Pity.
Well, she was singing very well in London (Croydon) two weeks ago.
Frank Murphy posted a link last week to a review in The UK Guardian.
The usually hard newspaper critic gave her five stars. Here's the link
again: http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/reviews/story/0,,1275329,00.html
complete with photo. Wish I'd gone.
Norm D.
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Message: 4
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 10:59:43 -0400
From: Lloyd Davis
Subject: Re: Beatles recordings abroad
Eddy wrote:
> No it didn't. Only Komm gib mir deine Hand is on that album.
I stand corrected. I somehow missed several words in this line from
the Spizer article I referenced previously: "Although Capitol helped
bury 'Sie Liebt Dich,' it later featured 'Komm, Gib Mir Deine Hand'
on its 'Something New' LP, which was released on July 20." Sorry for
the error.
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Message: 5
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 08:34:51 -0400
From: James Botticelli
Subject: Re: Beach Music
Phil X Milstein wrote:
> The most ubiquitous, and thus perhaps most popular, Beach song
> seems to be Clifford Curry's "She Shot A Whole In My Soul."
> Listen to these three in one sitting and, in my opinion, you'll
> about have it.
If you're still unsure, listen to the ultimate Beach anthem; The
Embers "I Love Beach Music".
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Message: 6
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 18:58:08 +0100
From: Joe Foster
Subject: Re: Don Thomas / Dave Berry / Sex Pistols
Mick Patrick:
> Anyway, back to Don Thomas, the brother of Jean of the Rag Dolls/
> Les Girls. A year or so ago, S'popper Ian Slater turned up a few
> songwriter demo acetates, one of which, although no performer was
> credited on the label, is most likely sung by Don. Knowing Ian,
> he'll see this message and post the track to musica. Then maybe
> someone who knows Don can positively identify his voice.
>
> Details are: "Don't Gimme No Lip Child", written by Don Thomas,
> Jean Thomas and Barry Richards.
>
> The song was recorded in 1964 by Dave berry as the b-side of "The
> Crying Game" and again, some years later, by those nice boys the
> Sex Pistols.
Phil M:
> From a Sex Pistols fansite:
> Paul Cook: "'Don't Gimme No Lip Child' is a Dave Berry cover that
> we totally changed. It's a jumpy uptight pop ditty. Berry was a
> crooner who fancied himself a sex symbol. It was Glen's idea to
> do it."
...and he still does on his solo gigs, regularly!
Joe
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Message: 7
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 20:33:35 +0100
From: Ian Slater
Subject: Don't Give Me No Lip Child - Don Thomas??
Mick Patrick said:
> Anyway, back to Don Thomas, the brother of Jean of the Rag Dolls/
> Les Girls. A year or so ago, S'popper Ian Slater turned up a few
> songwriter demo acetates, one of which, although no performer was
> credited on the label, is most likely sung by Don. Knowing Ian,
> he'll see this message and post the track to musica. Then maybe
> someone who knows Don can positively identify his voice.
>
> Details are: "Don't Gimme No Lip Child", written by Don Thomas,
> Jean Thomas and Barry Richards.
Thanks for the queue, Mick! I've uploaded the track and would be
pleased if anyone can identify the voice. All I can add to Mick's
info is from the label which is from Associated Recording Studios
of 723 Seventh Avenue at 48th Street. Any ideas? Over to you folks...
Ian Slater
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Message: 8
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 19:27:39 -0000
From: Tom
Subject: Re: Diamond Records Masters
I wrote:
> I wish someone out there knew who has posession of the Diamond
> masters; they need to get put out on CD.
Mikey:
> From what I'm told, a lot of the Diamond Records Masters were
> lost in a fire around 1973.
Paul Urbahns:
> I would think the question would be who owns the rights...
The problem is, no one knows who owns the rights....Ronnie Dove can't
remember who he says he bought the rights to his recordings from, and
he says he has his original tapes, yet uses vinyl for some reason for
cds?
As for Loop De Loop in stereo on the Stereo Oldies cd, that was taken
from a mint copy of the Loop De Loop stereo LP. That was also
conveniently licensed by Collectables Records. But the problem is, no
one knows who can claim ownership so they seem to be up for grabs,
which means the tapes could all be sitting in someone's basement
somewhere. After Diamond turned into Certron in 1971 and was bankrupt
by 1972 I have no idea where the tapes went after Aubrey Mayhew shut
down the company. Maybe he still has the tapes, I don't know.
--Tom
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Message: 9
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 17:40:47 EDT
From: Howard Earnshaw
Subject: Re:Beach Music
I remember visiting Myrtle Beach when I was working at Charleston.
It was November, so most of the place was shut, but the place did
look nice :-). One beach music record I heard there, but hadn't
time to find a vinyl copy of was, 'I Love Beach Music' by the
Embers. I loved the record with its references to other soul
records in the lyrics, like I saw Willie Tee he was walking up a
one way street.. If any US Specropoppers has a copy for sale or
trade let me know!
regards.. Howard
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Message: 10
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 17:43:11 EDT
From: Mike Rashkow
Subject: Re: Don't Give Me No Lip Child - Don Thomas?? / Associated Studios
Mick Patrick said:
> Anyway, back to Don Thomas, the brother of Jean of the Rag Dolls/
> Les Girls. A year or so ago, S'popper Ian Slater turned up a few
> songwriter demo acetates, one of which, although no performer was
> credited on the label, is most likely sung by Don. Knowing Ian,
> he'll see this message and post the track to musica. Then maybe
> someone who knows Don can positively identify his voice.
>
> Details are: "Don't Gimme No Lip Child", written by Don Thomas,
> Jean Thomas and Barry Richards.
Ian Slater:
> Thanks for the queue, Mick! I've uploaded the track and would be
> pleased if anyone can identify the voice. All I can add to Mick's
> info is from the label which is from Associated Recording Studios
> of 723 Seventh Avenue at 48th Street. Any ideas? Over to you folks...
Best little mono to mono to mono to mono to mono demos in NYC.
Bet the label is blue and white.
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Message: 11
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 17:59:00 -0400
From: Mikey
Subject: Re: Beach Music
Another great Beach Music song is "You're More Than A Number In My
Little Black Book" by The Drifters. Hard to find on CD, but great tune!
Mikey
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Message: 12
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 16:25:18 -0700
From: XmidX
Subject: Brill Bldg. inquiry
I'm looking for a photo of one of the small offices in the Brill Building, where
composers and copyists labored. Please advise.
Thanx.
xmidx@sbcglobal.net
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Message: 13
Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 23:15:09 -0400
From: Andrew C Jones
Subject: "Too Young To Be A Widow"
Is anyone here familiar with a single called "Too Young To Be A Widow"
by Cobey Carson, released around '64 on the Coed label (in the US)?
ACJ
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Message: 14
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 02:24:44 EDT
From: Al Kooper
Subject: Re: Sonny Curtis / 4-track Stax / Where Were You
Ed Salamon wrote:
> I'm also partial to Sonny's Elektra single from that time, "The Real
> Buddy Holly Story".
I love HIS version of "Walk Right Back"!
previously:
> Shortly after Epstein's visit, on April 6, the "Revolver" sessions began
> -- at Abbey Road. One question, though: did Stax even have four-track
> capability as of April '66?
Positively. In those days, England was WAY behind U.S. technology and
progress. Atlantic was already using 8-track at that point. The Beatles,
however, were pretty advanced in their musical thinking at that point.
George Martin was the fulcrum that made it all work – 2-track, 04 -track, 08 -track, whatever.
Pres wrote:
> In a related story, last night I was listening to another northern soul
> comp, Soothers and Movers , and reviewing the liner notes when I found
> that track #13, "Where Were You (When I Needed You) by Ernie Andrews
> was co-written by Mr. Al Kooper.
In those days I was very East Coast and the Ernie cover was very West
Coast. I loved the arrangement. It didn't ape the demo version at all and I
always like that. A lot of originallity in there. For a comparative comparison,
check out my concept on the Naked Songs album on Columbia, circa 1972.
Neither version borrows from the other.
al kooper
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Message: 15
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 03:13:54 EDT
From: Al Kooper
Subject: Blonde On Blonde bash / Diamond masters / pirate air
I just wanna say that at that Blonde On Blonde bash I recently participated
in in Gnashville, we were fortunate enough to get Charlie McCoy outa da
house to paticipate. I hadn't seen Charlie in decades, and it really made my
whole trip to see him at rehearsals and playing screaming harp and trumpet
on the gig. This was not a money gig, but that didn't bother him at all. I love
people like that. A portion of the money we made was set aside for Kenny
Buttrey, the original drummer on BonB, who is ailing with cancer at the
moment in TN.
Mikey wrote:
> From what I'm told, a lot of the Diamond Records masters were lost in
> a fire around 1973. Can't corfirm that, but most of the Ronnie Dove
> stuff out there is from records, so that kind of bears it out.
Collectables put the Loop De Loop Johnny Thunder album out on CD a
coupla years ago. Although with them you can never tell the source.
Joe Nelson wrote:
> I never said I agreed with the assessment (which was usually pre-
> Tommy when said anyway). If anything, I felt the breakdown was semi-
> intentional, being a sad comment on the sudden demise of the pirate
> stations. Now, to really complete the statement the breakdown would
> have led to the worst cuts on the LP -- because the BBC channel that
> was intended to replace the pirates was horrendous.
To really complete the circle, I am currently working up a one-hour radio
show for the current Radio Caroline.
Al Kooper
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Message: 16
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:39:50 -0400
From: Joe Nelson
Subject: Re: Ronnie Dove
Tom Diehl wrote:
> The problem is, no one knows who owns the rights. Ronnie Dove can't
> remember who he says he bought the rights to his recordings from, and
> he says he has his original tapes, yet uses vinyl for some reason for CDs?
He apparently just put the CDs together himself, to have something to sell
and give the fans something to buy. He has a turntable, but no reel-to-reel
deck capable of playing the tapes. From what you've told me privately, he
doesn't consider these CDs to be major releases.
Joe Nelson
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Message: 17
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 11:49:06 -0000
From: Ed B
Subject: Re: Don Thomas
Don Thomas, who is being discussed here, could possibly be the same as:
Don Thomas -- Turn Her Around/Do You Wanna Know (Minuteman 200)
Minuteman was a local Boston label in the mid-'60s, who also released three
45s by The Improper Bostonians.
Mmy notes from a letter published in Bomp (winter 76/77) states involement
on 45 release by Chip Taylor and Al Giorgioni, and also Don Thomas played
on the Just Us album on Kapp that featured I Can't Grow Peaches On A
Cherry Tree. The 45 was originally Minuteman 203.
Ed Bangs
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Message: 18
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 05:11:17 -0700 (PDT)
From: max weiner
Subject: As The Crow Flies & The Magic Lantern
I am trying to locate any info I can about the horn rock group Crow. As far
as I can remember, they only had one US chart hit: "Evil Woman (Don't
Play Your Games With Me)", circa 1969. If someone could tell me if this
song is available, either on a greatest hits or a compilation, I would
appreciate it. And also, if anyone could tell me about the band -- where
they come from, what happened to them, etc.
And lastly, I heard a story that the Magic Lantern, who did "Shame,
Shame", was actually the brainchild of John Paul Jones of Led Zeppelin
and produced by him. That song came out the same time as "Evil Woman".
Can somebody shed some light on this for me?
Thanks in advance!
Mac Joseph
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Message: 19
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 03:35:02 -0000
From: Fred Clemens
Subject: Re: Robert John / Bobby (Pedrick, Jr.) & The Consoles
Austin Roberts wrote:
> I think Bobby Pedrick's (pre Robert John) first single of any
> consequence, and Al, you can correct me on this, was White Bucks
> or White Buck Shoes or something like that, when he was 13.
The title was "White Bucks And Saddle Shoes", on Big Top Records in
the US (one of the first issues for the label, #3004), released on the Quality
label in Canada. I more favor the flip side, "Stranded". I don't know who
backed him, but they kind of remind me of the group that backed Dion
on his first outing for Mohawk, The Timberlanes.
Bobby had two more issues for the label, then one on Shell, and then
three for the Duel label before making the Diamond cut with The Consoles.
Anybody here close enough to Robert John to find out the name of the
group that backed him on "Stranded"?
Fred Clemens
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Message: 20
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 11:40:07 -0500
From: Steve Jarrell
Subject: Re: Beach Music / The Embers
Howard Earnshaw:
> I remember visiting Myrtle Beach when I was working at Charleston.
> It was November, so most of the place was shut, but the place did
> look nice :-). One beach music record I heard there, but hadn't
> time to find a vinyl copy of was, 'I Love Beach Music' by the
> Embers. I loved the record with its references to other soul
> records in the lyrics, like I saw Willie Tee he was walking up a
> one way street.. If any US Specropoppers has a copy for sale or
> trade let me know!
Hello Howard, I read your message and checked the Ripete Records
catalogue (www.ripete.com) and the Embers medley is on their 25th
anniversary album as well as on various beach music compilations.
It is referred to as the Embers Medley and a great piece of work.
The group is going through some personnel changes right now but
still continue to be headliners in Beach Music. Donny Weaver
(lead singer of "I'm A Girlwatcher" by the O'Kaysions had recently
joined the Embers as a keyboard player. Unfortunately, he had an
uto accident last week and is hospitalized. Hopefully, he will be
back shortly. There are several great beach bands still recording
product.
Good luck,
Steve Jarrell
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Message: 21
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 16:47:05 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Dobie Gray on White Whale
Hi, does anyone who has the original White Whale Dobie Gray 45's (3
of them). Below is the info I have. Can anyone fill in the blanks
for producers and writers? Thanks! Clark
Rose Garden
(Joe South)
White Whale single 300; 1969
Produced by Dennis, Maher and Amato
Where's The Girl Gone
(Tommy Amato)
White Whale single 300; 1969
Produced by Dennis, Maher and Amato
Do You Really Have A Heart
(Roger Nichols-Paul H. Williams)
White Whale single 330; 1969
Produced by
What A Way To Go
( )
White Whale single 330; 1969
Produced by
Guess Who
(Jessie and JoAnn Belvin)
White Whale single 342; 1970
Produced by
Honey, You Can't Take It Back
(Kenny Nolan)
White Whale single 342; 1970
Produced by Gary Zekley
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Message: 22
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 11:49:45 EDT
From: Mike Rashkow
Subject: Re: Don (& Jean) Thomas
Previously:
> ... Don Thomas -- Turn Her Around/Do You Wanna Know (Minuteman 200)
Minuteman was a local Boston label in the mid-'60s, who also released
three 45s by The Improper Bostonians. Certainly very likely. They also
released "You're The Root Of My Evil", written by Don and Jean Thomas.
Jean was the artist and I think Don and Bill (ask Al Kooper how to
spell it) were the producers.
I own a copy--any bids?
Di la,
Rashkovksy
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Message: 23
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 17:56:40 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Re: As The Crow Flies & The Magic Lantern
Mac Joseph wrote:
> I am trying to locate any info I can about the horn rock group
> Crow. As far as I can remember, they only had one US chart hit:
> "Evil Woman (Don't Play Your Games With Me)", circa 1969. If
> someone could tell me if this song is available, either on a
> greatest hits or a compilation, I would appreciate it. And also,
> if anyone could tell me about the band -- where they come from,
> what happened to them, etc.
>
> And lastly, I heard a story that the Magic Lantern, who did "Shame,
> Shame", was actually the brainchild of John Paul Jones of Led
> Zeppelin and produced by him. That song came out the same time as
> "Evil Woman". Can somebody shed some light on this for me?
Mac, not sure where you live, but here in the midwest US, Crow was
very popular in the early 70's. Dick Wagner was the leader and had
previously been an important part of Frost, the Bossmen and Cherry
Slush. Chicago's Dunwich guru Bill Traut signed Crow to his new
Amaret label and their first minor hit was "Time to Make a Turn"
which went top 10 in Wichita. "Evil Woman" was next. "Cottage
Cheese" became a very big AM/FM crossover record and big fave of the
group's fans still. In the early 90's, I helped KTel with their Crow
Cd "Best of" that is now out of print. It was a pretty good comp,
but did not include the Omaha top 10 "Something in Your Blood". I am
quite surprised there has not been any comp since. It is overdue to
revisit the catalog.
I've often heard stories about the 68 Magic Lantern. Ozzy Osborne's
group. WRONG. The John Paul Jones story may be true, I'm not sure.
Albert Hammond was a member. RIGHT! Except not on "Shame Shame".
He was with them in the early 70's when they had cool 45's of "One
Night Stand" and "Country Woman", I'm pretty sure. Anyone wanna get
the JP Jones story straightened out?
Clark
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Message: 24
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 15:53:09 EDT
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Blonde On Blonde bash
Al Kooper writes:
> I just wanna say that at that Blonde On Blonde bash I recently
> participated in in Gnashville, we were fortunate enough to get
> Charlie McCoy outa da house to paticipate. I hadn't seen Charlie
> in decades, and it really made my whole trip to see him at
> rehearsals and playing screaming harp and trumpet on the gig.
> This was not a money gig, but that didn't bother him at all. I
> love people like that. A portion of the money we made was set
> aside for Kenny Buttrey, the original drummer on BonB, who is
> ailing with cancer at the moment in TN.
Al, I was supposed to participate in the Kenny Buttrey tribute last
week but had to be out of town. I am sorry I missed you as I would
like to to see how many mutual friends we have. Sorry I couldn't
make it.
Austin Roberts
PS. Let me know when you're coming to Gnashville again.
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Message: 25
Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2004 11:21:14 -0700
From: Gary Myers
Subject: Crow
Mac Joseph:
> I am trying to locate any info I can about the horn rock group Crow.
Per Whitburn:
>From Minneapolis, Dave Wagner - lead voc; drummer Deny Craswell was in
the Castaways. Had 2 follow-up chart singles in 1970: Cottage Cheese
(#56), ("Don't Try To Lay No Boogie Woogie On The) King Of Rock & Roll"
(#52).
gem
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
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