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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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There are 26 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: Jeff Starr and WNRI
From: Dave O'Gara
2. Re: Keepnews
From: Phil Milstein
3. Re: Hawaiian music
From: Gary Myers
4. Re: more on "Hippies"
From: Dave Heasman
5. finding oldies CDs
From: Will Stos
6. Re: EMI Stereo
From: Frank Murphy
7. Re: where do all the "Hippies" meet?
From: Bill Tobelman
8. Re: Carson & Gaile
From: Charles
9. Hall of F(l)ame
From: Country Paul
10. Re: the pleasure of Gorgoni
From: Artie Butler
11. Miscellany (pt. 2)
From: Phil Milstein
12. Re: Ambient stereo
From: Mike
13. Film Biography of Nick Drake
From: "rex00720012000"
14. Miscellany (pt. 1)
From: Phil Milstein
15. Re: hippies, and beats, and The Monster That Devoured Cleveland
From: Chris Schneider
16. Re: which Rhonda?
From: Eddy Smith
17. Re: Nashville combos of the '50s
From: Austin Roberts
18. Projections location
From: Phil Hall
19. Demensions' "Over The Rainbow"
From: Austin Roberts
20. Re: EMI stereo
From: Mikey
21. hippies; 8 Ft.; Al Gorgoni; stereo/mono; Ricky on Verve; Murray
From: Country Paul
22. Re: where do all the "Hippies" meet?
From: Mike McKay
23. Re: Carson & Gaile and Frank & Nancy
From: Richard Havers
24. Re: EMI Stereo
From: Joe Nelson
25. Brian Wilson lead vocals
From: Charles Ulrich
26. David Gates = The Manchesters
From: Martin Roberts
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Message: 1
Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 23:58:08 -0000
From: Dave O'Gara
Subject: Re: Jeff Starr and WNRI
Country Paul asked:
> Was that the same Jeff Starr who worked at WNRI, Woonsocket, RI in
> the early '60s? He had a '49 Ford (I think it was) painted black with a star
> in a > circle on the door, which he called the Starrmobile; he took to
> record hops and the like.
I'm 99 percent sure the Jeff Starr you mention is the same one I know. He's
lived in southeast MA for a long time. He really made his mark in Worcester,
MA in the late 60's. He had stars on EVERYTHING. Just a year ago this month,
he attended a DJ reunion I put together and, as always, his attire was star-covered.
He now lives in Seekonk, MA, not too far from Woonsocket.
Dave O'
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 23:38:37 -0400
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Re: Keepnews
> From The New York Times, May 8, 2004
> Barney Kessel, 80, a Guitarist With Legends of Jazz, Dies
> By PETER KEEPNEWS
Sad to hear this news about one of our greatest guitarists. The author
of the obit, by the way, is the son of Orrin Keepnews, founder of the
Riverside and Milestone labels and one of our greatest jazz producers.
Last I heard Orrin, at age 80 or so himself, was still not only alive & kickin'
but actually still producing.
Long may they reign,
--Phil M.
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Message: 3
Date: Sun, 09 May 2004 10:23:41 -0700
From: Gary Myers
Subject: Re: Hawaiian music
Country Paul wrote:
> Mel & Tim's "Starting All Over Again" by the amazing and late Israel
> Kamakawiwo'ole (you may know of him from the voice-and-ukelele
> version of "Over The Rainbow/Wonderful World").
Did he do the words in the right order this time? ... And the right chords?
gem
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Message: 4
Date: Sun, 09 May 2004 19:10:08 +0100
From: Dave Heasman
Subject: Re: more on "Hippies"
S.J. Dibai wrote:
> What DID the term "hippies" mean in the early '60s?
In England we used the term for people who tried to be hip, but weren't quite.
Who had nearly-good haircuts, whose shoes almost looked genuinely Italian. I
think the term is used in an early Small Faces song. There was a significant cognitive
shift in meaning when the hairy, dirty hippies using the wrong (non-amphetamine)
drugs arrived on the scene.
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Message: 5
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 04:21:08 -0000
From: Will Stos
Subject: finding oldies CDs
I haven't posted in a long time because I've been so busy with
school, but summer is here at long last and I can emerge from the
library.
I noticed that a couple of new girl group CDs have been released by
Ace and RPM, but it took me a while to find them. Can anyone suggest
a good site that lists new compilations and reissues as they become
available?
Thanks,
Will : )
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Message: 6
Date: Sun, 09 May 2004 16:59:04 +0100
From: Frank Murphy
Subject: Re: EMI Stereo
previously:
> Thus George Martin opted to keep it seperate and keep it stereo, rhythm
> on left and vocals on right like the old days, with the break on the right to
> avoid the old "solo vacuum" that existed on the first two LPs when the
> solo came up. I believe much of the Hollies stuff follows this pattern.
I have heard Cliff Richard records from the early sixties recorded at Abbey
Road in which Cliff's vocals were centred and the instrumentation spread across
the channels. Norrie Paramor was the producer, but I presume he shared engineers
with The Beatle, The Hollies etc.
FrankM
reflections on northern soul Saturdays at 14:30 or listen now
www.radiomagnetic.com/archive/rnb.php
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Message: 7
Date: Sun, 09 May 2004 11:01:26 -0400
From: Bill Tobelman
Subject: Re: where do all the "Hippies" meet?
S.J. Dibai wrote:
> What DID the term "hippies" mean in the early '60s? The only records
> from that era that I recall hearing it in are Cameo-Parkway hits by
> Philly artists: The Orlons' "South Street," The Dovells' "You Can't
> Sit Down," Chubby Checker's "Birdland," etc. Was it a regionalism?
> And how did its meaning evolve from whatever it meant in 1963 to the
> late '60s, and indeed current, connotation of the term?
Hi everyone, this is my first post.
In Rhino's Beat Generation box set it is made clear that "hippie" meant "a
junior member of the hip scene." So my guess was that it was a bit of a put-
down when used by true hipsters.
-Bill
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Message: 8
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 07:50:48 -0000
From: Charles
Subject: Re: Carson & Gaile
Country Paul wrote:
> I confess I always liked Carson & Gaile's version of "Something Stupid"
> better than the Sinatras'. Of course, how do you compete against a
> legend and a legend-in-the-making?
Can anyone play the Carson & Gaile version of "Somethin' Stupid" to musica?
I'd love to hear it!
Charles
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Message: 9
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 00:34:33 -0400
From: Country Paul
Subject: Hall of F(l)ame
Martin Roberts wrote:
> I see nothing wrong with a crowd of music biz folk dressing up, drinking a
> few beers and giving out 'awards' to their pals ... but should anyone take
> it seriously?
We've had this discussion before in other contexts, but Martin puts it
exquisitely and succinctly. I'm with you all the way, my friend!
Country Paul
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Message: 10
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 09:37:33 EDT
From: Artie Butler
Subject: Re: the pleasure of Gorgoni
I just wanted to add my two cents about Al Gorgoni. He was not only a pleasure
on a recording session in a working situation, he was also a pleasure just to be
around. He was a gentle guy with a great sense of humor as well. We did hundreds
of sessions together playing all types of music. I might add that in all these years
since he has not changed a bit. He is still a pleasure to be around.
Artie Butler
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Message: 11
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:28:02 +0000
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Miscellany (pt. 2)
Some questions about a pair of 45s, from c.'64/'65:
The Fiends: Thank You Thing / Quetzal Quake (Dan D 1)
The Fiends: Theme From The Addams Family / Quetzal Quake (GNP Cresc. 335)
Any of y'all own either of these? Are the A-sides two diff. titlings for the
same recording? Was "Dan D" a custom label for Danny Davis? (This
appears to have been its only release.) Are all "Quetzal"-titled B-sides
a dead giveaway for Sonny Bono productions, or did some of his
colleagues start playing along, as an inside joke, with his titling theme?
* Interested to see some thoughts on favorite cover versions of Beach
Boys songs -- only those wr. or co-wr. by Brian Wilson, though. Female
vocals preferred!
* Would also like to start identifying Beach Boys songs on which Brian
sang lead, or at least had a prominent lead part. Frankly I have trouble
distinguishing his voice from Carl's.
--Phil M.
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Message: 12
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 07:46:48 -0400
From: Mike
Subject: Re: Ambient stereo
Mike McKay wrote:
> Recall that in the early 80s, a record label was actually founded upon
> this very premise, Ambient Sound. And from these efforts came a
> classic doo-wop performance, The Capris' "Morse Code of Love."
But the Ambient sound LPs were mixed live to regular stereo. There was
nothing "ambient" about them.
They were different because they were recorded live, and not to multitrack,
so there could be no mixing later. The records sounded great because of the
first generation sound.
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Message: 13
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 16:28:53 -0000
From: "rex00720012000"
Subject: Film Biography of Nick Drake
The long anticapated film biography of Nick Drake "A skin too
Few" has been released and can be seen at Cinema Village, 22
East 12 th Street, Greenwich Village. The film is only 48 minutes
in duration and focuses on Drakes's beautiful but haunting
music. The movie covers his recordings from '68 to '71 including
"Bryter Later" and "Pink Moon. The setting mostly takes place
around pastorol landscapes of Tanworth-in-Arden, where the
introspective Drake grew up.
As a footnote to this, Drake's record company has just released
a single in the U.K. called "Made to Believe in Magic"-a lost gem
from his recording archives.
Jim Shannon
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Message: 14
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:27:49 +0000
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Miscellany (pt. 1)
* David Gates, already an established force as a songwriter and
producer, proved himself with Bread to also be a fine singer. Yet,
unlike others whose career paths also brought them from behind-
the-scenes to some level of stardom (e.g., Barry White, Van McCoy),
I've never heard of Gates' having recorded a slew of singles under a
variety of pseudonymous artist credits. Did he serve in that capacity
and I missed it, or did he somehow avoid recording his own voice
prior to Bread?
* In reading the liner notes to Sundazed's fabulous Dino, Desi & Billy
comp, I learned (in passing) that Carl Wilson had been married at
different times to the sisters of two of that trio's members. And no,
neither of them was Lucie Arnaz.
* How is it that A & M Records never signed Ann-Margret? The promotional
possibilities of "A-M on A&M" seem boundless!
* Klaus Voorman intrigues me. He might be the only person who regularly
saw The Beatles play in Hamburg and remained friends with them
throughout (and beyond) the rest of their career; was an on-call bassist
for many of their later solo sessions; and designed one of their album
covers (Revolver). I believe he is still around, and yet, as far as I
know, he has never gone on record, at least not extensively, with his
Beatle memories. Has Voorman's story ever been properly told?
--Phil M.
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Message: 15
Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 20:37:08 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
From: Chris Schneider
Subject: Re: hippies, and beats, and The Monster That Devoured Cleveland
Dave O' wrote:
> I do know that Dobie Gillis was NOT the hippie on the old show.
> The hippie was Maynard G. Krebbs, as portrayed by Bob
> "Gilligan" Denver. And one bit of Maynard G. Krebbs trivia: In
> one episode, Dobie asked Maynard what the G. Stood for, and
> Krebbs answered "Walter." Now that's a hippie answer!
Hon', hon', hon' ... can't we even tell our Hippies from our Beats anymore?
Janis Joplin could, preferring (as I seem to remember) to identify with the
latter.
Maynard, whose favorite movie was "The Monster That Devoured Cleveland,"
was a Beat, back in the days (early '60s) when that notion was *somewhat*
topical. Although I suppose you could think of him as a transitional figure,
just as you could think of the character played by Cary Grant in "North By
Northwest," Roger O. Thornhill ("What does the 'O' stand for?" "Nothing."),
as a bit of a transitional figure himself.
I always liked the "Dobie Gillis" TV show. Perhaps its jazzy credits music
was where I acquired my taste for vocalese?
Chris A. ("The 'A' Stands For Borges") Schneider
P.S. I also suspect that I got my notion of the *ewige-weibliche* from Tuesday
Weld's Thalia Menninger -- bless her! -- even if Sheila James' Zelda was
probably the more authentic hipster.
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Message: 16
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 08:08:22 +0200
From: Eddy Smith
Subject: Re: which Rhonda?
Dave O'Gara wrote:
> I was listening to American Gold this weekend and heard Dick play the
> Beach Boys "Help Me Rhonda", the version with the instrumental lead-in.
> I have a version that starts with a cold vocal open on one of my vinyl
> Beach Boys Lps and it got me to wondering which version was original.
> The one Bartley played today seems to have a more pronounced lead
> guitar throughout compared to my version. Anyone know which version
> was the one that hit #1 back in '65?
Help Me Rhonda originally appeared on the Beach Boys Today album in
its full version. The single version is shorter, faster and does not have the
fade. The 45 version subsequently appeared on the Summer Days album.
Eddy
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Message: 17
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:53:19 EDT
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Nashville combos of the '50s
Gary Myers wrote:
> Austin, How far back to you go in Nashville? I'm trying to find a
> Maurice White (aka Marty Wyte, and no connection to the EWF guy)
> who recorded there from about '58 - '61. I visited that website
> http://nashlinks.com/sixties.htm and I've sent the same question
> to them.
I only go back to Nashville since 1968, but one of my best friends grew up
in Nashville, and I know Brenda Lee fairly well, plus many others who were
here in the '50s, and they all attest to the fact that the Casuals were the first
authentic rock and roll band in Nashville.
Not having been here in the '50s myself, that's all I can tell you, but I will say
that enough knowledgeable people have told me the same thing. If you know
something different, please tell us about it.
By the way, you may want to pick up a copy of Buzz's new book, Living The
Rock And Roll Dream, I know Borders carries it. I've known Buzz well for 30
years now and have never heard anything that wasn't completely true come out
of his mouth.
Best,
Austin Roberts
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Message: 18
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:11:21 -0000
From: Phil Hall
Subject: Projections location
To Al Kooper:
I've always loved the cover photo on The Blues Project's album
"Projections". It was obviously shot somewhere in New York, but
do you recall the exact location (street and/or interesection)?
Thanks,
Phil H.
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Message: 19
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 13:27:15 EDT
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Demensions' "Over The Rainbow"
Not that this is meant to be a new string for us to follow, but my favorite
remake of a "standard" is The Demensions' 1960 version of Over The
Rainbow. Just wondering if others like the record.
a curious Austin Roberts
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Message: 20
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:46:38 -0400
From: Mikey
Subject: Re: EMI stereo
George Martin did The Beatles that way because he wanted the option
of compressing the vocals or instruments independently, to get a harder
sound.
With Cliff and the Shads, the sound was more orchestrated, rather than
pure rock like The Beatles, and lent itself better to true stereo mixes. I
love the Shads in stereo.
That's one band and one instance where nobody can say the mono sounds
better -- it doesn't. The Shads in stereo is a fantastic listening experience.
Listen to the stereo Wonderful Land with the strings -- it doesn't get better
than that.
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Message: 21
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:57:38 -0400
From: Country Paul
Subject: hippies; 8 Ft.; Al Gorgoni; stereo/mono; Ricky on Verve; Murray
I'm jumping ahead of my usual catching-up to see what folks are talking
about today. ...
Richard Williams on hippies and hipsters:
> In the jazz world slang of the time, a "hipster" was
> an authentically cool person, i.e. someone who understood the
> meaning of Charlie Parker and John Coltrane; a "hippie" was someone
> who tried, but would never get it -- in other words, more or less
> the opposite of the later definition (altho us mods didn't consider
> summer-of-love hippies to be that cool, actually...).
As I was told by friends in Philadelphia, the term as used by The Orlons
referred to the trendy mainly-black society who populated the South Street
Philly area, and was meant as a positive. (The Tams also had a 45 on Parkway,
"Memory Lane," recorded under the name The Hippies.) As subsequently
adapted, "hippies" was first applied by the press to a group of primarily
young people it couldn't otherwise quantify. The original west coast folks
called themselves "freaks," among other terms. And I think we US types
thought you mods to be a bit too image-obsessed for our anti-image
tastes! :-)
Me, earlier:
> (Eight Feet's "Bobby's Come A Long, Long Way") It's good (I know
> Al Kooper is involved with this), but the flip side, "What Am I Without
> You," is a gorgeous folkie-influenced track and a personal fave.
Al Kooper:
> My involvement was co-writing, arranging and co-producing. I love
> the B-side myself - should I clean both sides up and post 'em?
Yes, please -- my mono 45 (that cheap styrene Columbia pressing of the era)
is pretty scratchy from heavy play at home ... and some play on the air back
then!
Paul Evans wrote:
> A thumbs-up for Al. Along with Charlie Macey, Al
> Gorgoni was one of the first guitarists that I ever worked with
> in the New York studios. Not only has he always been a terrific
> picker, he's always had a great studio attitude and was always fun
> to have on a session.
Al Kooper:
> He's also a great guy to just hang with.
Which I have had the pleasure of doing. Still haven't convinced him to join
the discussion, though, Al; maybe you'd have better luck! (Contact me off-
list for his address and e-mail, if necessary.)
Mike McKay, re: stereo/mono:
> Depending on the nature of the record, there may be many
> instances when it would be virtually impossible to do a
> stereo mix that sounds better than a mono one.
You then cite thin recordings or spare instrumentation as reasons, to which
I'd agree unless each instrument was miked in stereo to get the expanded
ambience. But some records need a "splashy" fat sound to survive. Example:
on the Raindrops CD on Collectables, "The Kind of Boy You Can't Forget" is
"stereo" -- vocals on one side, instrumental on the other. A powerhouse 45
becomes a hollow-centered promise that never delivers. And of course there
are dozens of other early examples, starting with the Beatles and working
onward from there.
continuing with Mike's:
> I have a hard time listening to most contemporary blues or
> rockabilly. There may be great songs and great performances,
> but what's missing is the ambiance of the Chess or Sun studios.
> It's like another instrument: take it away and replace it with
> crisp digital recording, and you've missed the whole point.
A good recording engineer with the proper equipment can get that sound --
your later comment about full-stereo miking, which the Beach Boys did on
"Sunflower," for example -- but here's where classic analog equipment can
also make a huge difference.
Mike again re: live concerts:
> Unless there have been major changes in live sound in recent years,
> I'm betting that all but the biggest-name bands still mix in mono --
> that is, both the instruments and vocals are mic'd, then brought
> through the mixing board/PA system and sent out to the main
> speakers equally in both channels. (If I'm wrong about this, I
> hope someone will bring me into the 21st century!)
I've been to concerts where there is apparently stereo, but not a super-wide
stereo, so that folks on one side of the hall don't miss what's happening on
the other.
> Recall that in the early '80s, a record label was actually
> founded upon this very premise (full stereo miking), Ambient
> Sound. And from these efforts came a classic doo-wop
> performance, The Capris' "Morse Code of Love."
Yes indeed, not to mention a series of lesser but still worthwhile albums
from Randy & The Rainbows and half a dozen other doo-wop era artists who
were still working in the '80s.
Michael Fishburg wrote:
> [Barney] Kessell arranged and played on one of young Rick(y)
> Nelson's first outing on Verve records, "Honey Rock".
I only have 1-1/2 45's by Nelson on Verve (I forget the title of the 2nd,
but the flip is not by Rick). Do you, or does anyone here, know how many
sides Nelson cut for Verve, and if they're collected on a CD or LP?
Ted T. wrote:
> Very nice to see the discussion and remembrances of Murray the K.
> The 'Swingin' Soiree', with its resolute R&B slant, was a life-saver to
> many (including me) between 1959 and 1963.
I'm look forward to checking out the discussion of Murray, but haven't yet,
so forgive me if the following has already been mentioned. I first remember
him doing overnights on WINS and finding his groove -- a Jewish guy with a
southern accent. When WINS morning man Irv Smith was killed in a traffic
accident, Murray was moved to the morning slot; I remember it as an improper
fit, but I wonder if any airchecks exist that would prove me right or wrong.
Shortly thereafter he transformed himself as "Murray The K on the Swingin'
Soiree."
I remember the last night he did a live audience call-in on WINS. He used to
talk to various "kids" around the area for drop-ins about music, sponsors,
etc. One of his sponsors was a trendy clothing store, "R&G Hempstead," on
Long Island, and Murray had a kid named Mike on the line with him. They were
pumping each other up regarding the threads, Murray making him part of an
extended spot, and in the course of the raving Mike says, "Hey Murray, there's
somethin' the kids here in Hempstead wanna tell ya." Murray replies, "What's
that, Mike?" The kid blurts out, "F@#$^&* you, Murray!" Long silence. A
record wows in. All future phoners are done on tape!
Warren:
> The Vision: Threshold Of Love....Uni 55301; wr. D. Grady/G.Zekley;
> pr. "Yodar Critch"
Any chance of posting it to musica, please?
Country Paul
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Message: 22
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:48:44 -0000
From: Mike McKay
Subject: Re: where do all the "Hippies" meet?
Bill Tobelman wrote:
> In Rhino's Beat Generation box set it is made clear that "hippie"meant "a
> junior member of the hip scene." So my guess was that it was a bitof a put-
> down when used by true hipsters.
Except that, at least when it comes to "South Street," it's hard to make a case
for this connotation.
If the place is described as "the hippest street in town" where "the dancing is
elite", the music makes you "move your feet" and you're exhorted to "hurry
down" to meet the singer -- well, it all sounds pretty positive to me.
I think that in the context of the question as originally asked -- that is, what did
"hippie" signify in "South Street" and other Cameo tunes -- we're making
things more complicated than they need to be. At least in this realm, a "hippie"
was simply a hip person.
Mike
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Message: 23
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 20:17:48 +0100
From: Richard Havers
Subject: Re: Carson & Gaile and Frank & Nancy
Charles wrote:
> Can anyone play the Carson & Gaile version of "Somethin' Stupid"
> to musica? I'd love to hear it!
I can't do that, I don't have it, but I can give you this interview from
Carson. It was done last year by Kingsley Abbott for a book I'm just
finishing reading. Kingsley said he was a very nice guy to talk with.
---------------------------------
It was a strange period in the sixties. I had had my scholastic years
doing lots of courses -– poetry, originally a drama major which led me
to read Shakespeare, etc. I had a stopwatch with three reminders on it:
"Keep It Simple", "Tell The Truth" and "Let It Swing". I pretty well
followed those rules for my songwriting.
"Somethin' Stupid" came from the material for my duet album with
Gaile. I had realised that the songwriters get more money from records,
so I had written seven out of the twelve tunes, and of these six were
recorded by others! There was one dog. The Carson & Gaile version
was the original recording of the song, in November 1966, but as
Christmas was upon us, we did not release it then. My manager Wally
Brady knew Mo Ostin, who at that time was running Reprise for Frank
Sinatra. Wally said to me, "Do you want to pay the bills, or take a chance
on being a star?" He got a tape of the song to Mo and asked him to put
it on top of the pile. Frank used to fly up every Friday from Palm Springs
to Burbank to do the business things. Well, it seems that upon hearing it
Frank called Nancy and said, "We gotta do this!" Mo thought it was a dog,
but Frank thought it was top ten. The song had been written as a duet,
and at that time Frank hadn’t done a duet. The song was in the right place
at the right time –- Nancy was on the teen rock stations, a market Frank
hadn’t cracked, and at that stage Nancy hadn’t cracked the MOR market.
They did a whale of a job with it!
I had the last line first. So I had to figure out how to get to it. There are
long lines in the song, and I guess that is because some ideas need more
explaining! It all depends what your message is. Another song from that
duet album of mine was "Cab Driver", which was done by The Mills
Brothers. That one had more traditional four-stanza verses. The melody
of "Somethin' Stupid" goes 5th, 6th, major 7th. The Sinatras' arrangement
was the same as ours, same key even, except that they added strings. They
even hired James Burton to play the guitar intro. He had played on our
version, and Frank had said he wanted to get the same player who had
done the intro. They made a couple of slight word changes, but nothing
that altered the sense.
There was another song of mine that he was going to do, "Open For
Business As Usual". They had the arrangement all done and the session
booked, but then Frank threw his back out and the session was cancelled
and never reinstated. The song was done later by people like Jack Jones
and Steve & Eydie.
Best,
Richard
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Message: 24
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 15:02:59 -0400
From: Joe Nelson
Subject: Re: EMI Stereo
Frank Murphy wrote:
> I have heard Cliff Richard records from the early sixties recorded at
> Abbey Road in which Cliff's vocals were centred and the instrumentation
> spread across the channels. Norrie Paramor was the producer, but I
> presume he shared engineers with The Beatle, The Hollies etc.
George Martin has said the purpose of the isolated stereo was that it
made for better mono -- you could wait until the last minute to blend
the voices into the backing. The quote didn't go on to say this was
SOP at EMI, so Paramor may well have opted for the direct stereo
approach pre-1964.
Accounts contradict. On the one hand, it's really not a good idea to
have a two-channel "full spectrum" base on a four-track tape that is
intended to be remixed for mono and stereo. The sound pressure is
greater in the center than the extremes, and there was no way to knock
down the center when you tried to compress the whole picture into a
single space.
Yet when the four-track machines first came to EMI, for about a year
they were used exclusively on operas (with pop still relegated to two-
track sessions). EMI's approach was to record the orchestra in stereo
on one and two, then put the voices on three and four. Yet this approach
also suggests the mono dubdown would be flawed. Some classical lovers
still bought mono in those days, so how does this reconcile?
My copy of Mark Lewissohn's The Beatles' Recording Sessions has been
lost to me for a couple of years, which is unfortunate because I'd filled
it with a pile of footnotes that I'd have loved to perused now. Much of it
addressed either factual conflicts or questions of conduct (i.e. why was the
"She Loves You" two-track wiped when EMI policy in 1963 was to preserve
session tapes?; how was the eight-track "Hey Jude" remixed for mono at
EMI a month before EMI's eight-track was put into service?) EMI was a very
bizarre operation and management made a number of strange calls, such as
buying tape machines for thousands of pounds but saving money by not
buying power cords for them! EMI in the sixties was so monaurally oriented
that the left speaker was kept turned off until it was time to remix for stereo:
supposedly the speakers were saved for stereo orchestral recordings (so you
wear out the right one faster, bozos: wouldn't alternating left/right on a daily
basis have made more sense?)
Joe Nelson
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 25
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:46:47 -0700
From: Charles Ulrich
Subject: Brian Wilson lead vocals
Phil M. wrote:
> Would also like to start identifying Beach Boys songs on which Brian
> sang lead, or at least had a prominent lead part. Frankly I have trouble
> distinguishing his voice from Carl's.
>From the albums at hand:
I'm So Young
She Knows Me Too Well
Let Him Run Wild
You're So Good To Me
I'm Bugged At My Old Man
You Still Believe In Me
Don't Talk (Put Your Head On My Shoulder)
I'm Waiting For The Day
I Just Wasn't Made For These Times
Caroline, No
Good To My Baby (Brian and Mike)
Don't Hurt My Little Sister (Mike and Brian)
When I Grow Up (Mike and Brian)
Please Let Me Wonder (Brian and Mike)
Kiss Me Baby (Brian and Mike)
Amusement Parks U.S.A. (Mike with Brian)
Salt Lake City (Mike with Brian)
The Little Girl I Once Knew (Carl, Brian, and Mike)
Dance, Dance, Dance (alternate take) (Mike and Brian)
Wouldn't It Be Nice (Brian on verses, Mike on bridge)
That's Not Me (Mike on verses, Mike and Brian on choruses)
Sloop John B. (Brian and Mike)
I Know There's An Answer (Mike and Al on verses, Brian on choruses)
Carl sang Girl Don't Tell Me, God Only Knows, and Good Vibrations.
--Charles
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 26
Date: Wed, 12 May 2004 09:05:06 +0100
From: Martin Roberts
Subject: David Gates = The Manchesters
Phil M., in a flurry of writing activity almost in the Country Paul tradition,
asked about any vocal skeletons that may be lurking in Mr. Gates' wardrobe.
Playing on musica, The Manchesters "I Don't Come From England" (VJ),
written, arranged and, as I've always understood, sung by David Gates.
Quite a fun record, sorta doo-wop Merseybeat produced by David Mook for
Past Present and Future Productions.
Martin
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