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Spectropop - Digest Number 194

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          a egalement enregistre - Super 45 tours - microsillon

There are 10 messages in this issue of Spectropop.

Topics in this Digest Number 194:

      1. Kenny Karen
           From: "Donny Hampton" 
      2. Francoise Hardy:  fine chansoniere
           From: "J.H. Ket" 
      3. Re: Any info on this record?
           From: "Peter Lerner" 
      4. Imitation or Inspiration? 
           From: LePageWeb 
      5. Clingers!!
           From: Christopher Davidson
      6. Songs by Jackie DeShannon
           From: "Peter Lerner" 
      7. classical inclusions
           From: Freeman Carmack 
      8. Re: Francoise Hardy, France Gall, Sheila etc
           From: Patrick Rands 
      9. who is Roger Mores??
           From: Alan Miller 
     10. Walker Bros - "The Sun Ain't Gonna Shine Anymore"
           From: Mark Harris


Message: 1
   Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 17:24:38 -0000
   From: "Donny Hampton" 
Subject: Kenny Karen

 Dan Hughes wrote:
>I have a Columbia 45 rpm record, 04 -42264, complete
>with picture sleeve, by Kenny Karen.
>Side 1:  Oh, Susie Forgive Me, written by Mann & Weil
>Side 2:  The Light In Your Window, written by King,
>Goffin, and A. Ripp
>Both sides arranged and conducted by Alan Lorber, and
>produced by Nevins-Kirshner Associates, Inc.
>Who was this guy, how was he able to get songs by these
>writers and a major label release, and why have we
>never heard of him?

Kenny Karen was a protege of Don Kirshner's.  According
to Alan Betrock's book GIRL GROUPS, there was a big
promotional push on his singles in the early '60s.  I
think he may have recorded for Columbia.  Karen was on
Kirshner's short list to sing lead for The Archies in

Don Charles

-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------

Message: 2
   Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 11:55:42 +0200
   From: "J.H. Ket" 
Subject: Francoise Hardy:  fine chansoniere

Hello Spectropoppers,

> Martin wrote:
> >
> >Francoise Hardy "The Vogue Years" UK BMG74321 822322 rel
> >'01 A must buy. 50 tracks of the very best of French,UK
> >(Charles Blackwell) & even US (Mickey Baker) pop. Can't
> >find any of my favourites missing, great Spector Sound A
> >Likes, great attitude & great looks! Good colour booklet.
> >All of these are French language recordings so I'd guess
> >English vocal's compilation to follow. But don't wait
> >buy this now! For those new to Francoise's charms start
> >at track 14 her version of The Joys "I Still Love Him"

Frank wrote

> The only thing I  will never understand is where anyone 
> can find any relations between Francoise Hardy's 
> recordings and Phil Spector ?

Though Francoise Hardy is a fine chansoniere/french pop
singer in her own right, during the early sixties she
recorded some songs with producer C. Blackwell which are
influenced by the girlgroup/spector-sound. I know about
10 songs on which some of Spector's trademarks are
obviously present. 

Martin mentioned (the Joys) I Still Love Him, other
examples are the ringing "Da doo ron ron" piano and
rhythm on "Je n'attends plus personne & Tu es venu a moi",
back beat rhythm and drum fills (Il voyage, Les petis
garcons). In general the "early" Crystals stand as the
main prototype for these productions. I like to identify
the following songs as "Spector"-sound-a-likes:

Je veux qu'll revienne (Only you can do it)
Il voyage
Er muss reisen (Il voyage).
How ever much (Et meme)
Et meme (How ever much)
Pourtant tu m'aimes (I still love him)
Tu es venu a moi
Dann bist du verliebt
Je n'attends plus personne
Les petits garcons

If anyone has other examples of Francoise's
girlgroup/spector connections I'm interested.

Hans Ket

-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------

Message: 3
   Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 14:56:35 +0100
   From: "Peter Lerner" 
Subject: Re: Any info on this record?

"Dan Hughes" wrote:
> I have a Columbia 45 rpm record, 04 -42264, complete
> with picture sleeve, by Kenny Karen.
> Side 1:  Oh, Susie Forgive Me, written by Mann & Weil
> Side 2:  The Light In Your Window, written by King,
> Goffin, and A. Ripp
> >
> Both sides arranged and conducted by Alan Lorber, and
> produced by Nevins-Kirshner Associates, Inc.
> Who was this guy, how was he able to get songs by these
> writers and a major label release, and why have we
> never heard of him?

I wondered about him, too. The 45 was considered good
enough for UK release on Philips PB 1213, the label
saying "first published 1961". I bought it because of the
eminent writers, but truth be told, it's dross.


-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------

Message: 4
   Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 10:15:18 +0900
   From: LePageWeb 
Subject: Imitation or Inspiration? 

John Clemente wrote:

> I think that the business of accidental or purposeful
> soundalikes is an interesting strand.  I'm thinking more
> and more that there are finite melodies and arrangements
> within a particular genre of music.  Here are some of my
> discoveries, some probably obvious to you, that either
> are the same songs note for note or borrow passages:

> Makin' With The Magilla - Little Eva (Follow me now
> ...)/Sweet Seasons (inst. bridge) - Carole King

*grin* I dunno. You mean the sax intro to the former and
the sax line during the inst. break in the latter? If so,
I sorta follow you...
> The 81 - Candy & The Kisses/In My Lonely Room - Martha &
> The Vandellas

"The 81" has always struck me as being a lift from
"Needle in a Haystack" by the Velvelettes. I often notice
Motown lifts - a recent purchase "Where the Girls Are #3"
has a few if memory serves. 

> These are just off the top of my head.  Anyone want to
> add to this list?

Well, as has been pointed out by several people already
this subject is a bottomless pit. We'll never make a
comprehensive list but it is interesting to hear what
connections others make. 

While this was rolling around in the back of my mind
today I heard a song for the first time called Mr. Summer
by the McCoys. I know the McCoys primarily for their
rockin' Berns/Strangeloves' produced Hang on Sloopy style
but Mr. Summer is a surprising slice of West Coast (ish)
harmony pop that owes a lot more than sunshine to the
Beach Boys' California Girls. Anyone else heard this? 

Speaking of which - Gary Lewis & the Playboys She's
Just My Style is "just Brian's style" too!

,,,and let us not forget Miss Cathy Brasher's He Told Me
He Loved Me - a carbon copy of Then He Kissed Me, right
down to the lyric!


-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------

Message: 5
   Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 06:49:38 -0700 (PDT)
   From: Christopher Davidson 
Subject: Clingers!!

Hey All,

> A combination of places have mentioned the Clinger
> Sisters - Curt B. from the Millennium produced a
> side, Kim Fowley produced a side, and one of the
> Rock Flowers was a my question is -
> where can I find their recordings? Are they on any
> compilations? Does anyone have a discography? Anyone
> feel like making an mp3 or two?

I second this!  These gals were so great!  From the
little I know about 'em, they started as featured girl
singers on the Danny Kaye show, which I'm guessing may
have been like an attempt to make them the girl Osmond
Bros. over on the Andy Williams show.  There's a Danny
Kaye album out there featuring the four sisters.  From
there, they cut some tunes for Mike Curb.  I have an
amazing clip of them on Bandstand in 1969 with Curb
doing a long intro of them, before they launch into (I
think) "Gonna Have A Good Time Tonite," or something
close to that.  (Sidebar:  They were so hot, it's
ridiculous.) Then, I'm pretty sure one was the singing
voice for Kitty Jo of the Cattanooga Cats cartoon. 
Also, later in the 1970s, Debra (?) was one of Kaptain
Kool and the Kongs on the Kroft TV series and album,
and one was definately in the Rock Flowers, as has
been revealed already.  They made other TV
appearances, too, as I have the whole band
lip-synching a good rocker on the Smothers Brothers
show.  Plus, I believe one of the sisters (can't
recall which) appeared in a Michael J Fox movie in
maybe 1980-82.

Chris Davidson
CAD Records

-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------

Message: 6
   Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 15:04:30 +0100
   From: "Peter Lerner" 
Subject: Songs by Jackie DeShannon

A couple of years ago the Jackie DeShannon Appreciation
Society compiled what we thought was the complete and
final list of all of Jackie DeShannon's hundreds of
compositions and co-compositions, together with all known
recorded versions. Well, the act of publishing it brought
in information about many others that we hadn't heard of.
We're about to update the list and re-publish it on the
JDSAS website (where you can find the original list), but
it occurred to me that all you Spectropoppers out there
might have a lot more updates stored in your record

If you do, please can you email me and who knows, you
might get a name check on the JDSAS website.

Just as an example - within the last 2 weeks we've
learned of a previously (to us) unheard song, "By a long
shot", recorded very nicely indeed by Patti Page on a
Mercury 45, a brooding ballad which would not be at all
out of place on those legendary DeShannon / Sheeley
Metric demo tapes. More please!

Thanks to everyone. 

Peter Lerner

The Jackie DeShannon Appreciation Society
-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]------------------- Message: 7 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 15:19:25 -0000 From: Freeman Carmack Subject: classical inclusions It just dawned on me; speaking of Icky lists-how about Manilow's lifting of a Chopin Etude (can't recall OP.# or key-c minor I think) for "Could it Be Magic" from '75-his ode to "sweet Melissa" Manchester. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]------------------- Message: 8 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 17:17:51 -0000 From: Patrick Rands Subject: Re: Francoise Hardy, France Gall, Sheila etc Hmm, France Gall and Francoise Hardy are being talked about here? Perfect timing! Because this Friday night I am doing a one hour French Ye Ye spotlight show on WZBC here in Boston. Here's the info: You can tune in from 6 to 7 PM Eastern USA time, Friday night (June 29) at 90.3 WZBC in Boston, Massachusetts, USA. You can also listen to it online at . I hope you can tune in! Patrick -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]------------------- Message: 9 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2001 11:27:34 -0400 From: Alan Miller Subject: who is Roger Mores?? I have been dementing myself trying to find information on this euro jazz pianist. My search for his LP "The Sound of Roger Mores" (Belgian Vogue) is as yet fruitless. Does anyone know anything about this artist??. I am certain he was one of those producers who would have provided orchestral backing and arrangements on all manner of french pop artists releases in the 1960's a la Jean Bouchety, Alain Gourage, Tony Hatch and Johnny Harris. Thanks in advance if anybody can shed some light here. Alan. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]------------------- Message: 10 Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 07:57:50 +0100 From: Mark Harris Subject: Walker Bros - "The Sun Ain't Gonna Shine Anymore" Hello, Just been blown away by the above on the wireless - 25 years too late, really, but there you go. Is it a Spector production? It certainly sounds like it. Is from a Spector produced album, does anybody know? If not, any ideas where I could pick it up from? Regards, Mark -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]------------------- End

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