http://www.spectropop.com __________________________________________________________ __________________________________________________________ __________ __________ __________ S P E C T R O P O P __________ __________ __________ __________________________________________________________ Volume #0398 March 26, 2000 __________________________________________________________ Stereo has Come of Age Subject: Spector Xmas and Ronettes on 4 track Received: 03/25/00 6:01 am From: WASE RADIO To: Spectropop! To Jamie LePage: In your mention about the Stan Ross quote concerning that the Spector Xmas and Ronettes material was recorded on 4 track, I thought some instances might lend some credence to this. On "Walking in the Rain" heard in stereo, the thunderstorm effects is first heard left then pans quickly to the right when the music starts on the left. The background vocals are heard on the right then Ronnie's voice is heard right. Now here is the scoop. On the playout of the song you hear the rhythm section on the left channel, Her ooohh oh vocal in the center and background vocals on the right-and at the same time you hear the thunderstorm effect start on the left then pans to the right. You are hearing four tracks of sound on that passage. Some of the other Ronettes songs have the background vocals on the right-on "Walking in the Rain", "Do I Love You?", "The Best Part of Breaking Up". On the songs "Be My Baby" and "Baby I Love You" the background vocals are heard in the center with the lead with the majestic Jack Nitszche strings taking up the right channel. Could it be a three or four track project on those aforemtioned songs? There were a couple of Ronettes songs that were not recorded at Gold Star-"When I Saw You" and "So Young". According to the Phil Spector box set, these cuts were recorded at United Studios, also in Hollywood-possibly on four tracks. Also your part about the technique of bouncing vocal tracks on the 1958 Teddy Bears recordings, brings back a memory of reading something in Mark Ribowsky's somewhat scathing book on Spector. One day Phil experimented with having the back track to play through the speakers as he was recording his vocal. In other words he was allowing that playback to be recorded into the mike he was singing into. It suposedly created an echo effect. More later. Got get to get back to work Michael G. Marvin WASE radio --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- Subject: I&TT/Gold Star Received: 03/25/00 6:01 am From: Phil Chapman To: Spectropop! Jamie asks: > Finally, does anyone know if the I&TT album on A&M was > mixed in stereo at Gold Star or A&M, and how many tracks > were used for these recordings? The 1966 UK album "River Deep - Mountan High" was issued in stereo(SHU 8298)and contains more or less the same mixes as the later A&M release. They are probably 4-track: Rhythm, orchestral, lead, backgrounds. The Checkmates Ltd album however sounds 8 track to me, possibly: 1. Drums, bass, percussion (still too early for a stereo drumkit) 2. Keyboards, guitars 3 & 4. Strings & Brass in stereo 5 & 6. Background vocals in stereo 7. Lead Vocal 8. Solo instrument Although there is no credit, I can't see why it wouldn't have been recorded & mixed at Gold Star. As far as I can ascertain, the leading studios went 8-track around 1967 and progressed thru 16-track to 24-track by around 1973. Phil --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- Subject: three 24 tracks when Gold Star closed Received: 03/25/00 6:01 am From: WASE RADIO To: Spectropop! Hi Jamie: I don't know when Gold Star has added on more tracks, but I do know that when the facility was closed down in March 1984, they had three studios all with 24 tracks. I have somewheres a letter from Johnette at Gold Star that I received in March 1983. If I can find it, I like to post it. Happy listening to everyone:):):):):) Michael G. Marvin WASE radio --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- Subject: Re: Bruce Botnick Received: 03/24/00 8:00 am From: Stewart Mason To: Spectropop! Jamie LePage says: >Bruce Botnick's name on the Expecting to Fly credits do >indicate that the side was not cut at Gold Star. To the >best of my knowledge, Botnick did not regularly work at >Gold Star. It is important to note that Dave Gold custom >built Gold Star's board and (at least to a certain extent) >an engineer would have to be familiar with Gold's >equipment to be able to comfortably work there. >Consequently, the studio's in-house engineers are the >names we most often associate with Gold Star recordings. >Does anyone know of Botnick working at Gold Star? Steve >Kurutz writes at AMG: "After landing a gig at L.A.'s >Sunset Sound in 1963, Botnick found himself engineering >at a time when the West Coast was exploding onto the >national consciousness." Can anyone confirm whether or >not Botnick was a staff producer for Elektra in the late >60s? In FOLLOW THE MUSIC (FirstMedia, 1998), Jac Holzman's combination autobiography/oral history of Elektra Records, Jac talks about meeting Bruce Botnick while he was looking for a studio to record Love's debut in: "We had heard good things about Sunset Sound....I decided to check out the facilities early, look into the mixing board, four-track Ampexes, available mikes and schmooze with the engineer assigned to Mark Abramson and me. I sauntered in and saw this kid, whom I took to be no more than 19, deftly moving his fingers over the console and generally looking like he knew what he was doing. He told me his name was Bruce Botnick." Actually, in the accompanying picture of Bruce at the Sunset Sound console in 1966, he looks *maybe* 16! Definitely Mr. Babyface! Elsewhere in the book, when talking about engineering the Doors' sessions at Sunset Sound under Paul Rothchild, Bruce says that Sunset Sound "was built basically to do Disney records, which [studio owner] Tutti Camarata was head of. So we'd be doing Mickey and Minnie and Cinderella in the daytime, and in the afternoon and night doing the Doors. It was really Disney's house, and to have a little madness in there kind of made things uncomfortable for Tutti." This suggests that at least through early '67, it was the folks at Sunset Sound who signed Bruce Botnick's checks, not Elektra, which makes it unlikely that he did much work at other studios during this period. The question is, when exactly was "Expecting To Fly" recorded? Later in the book, Botnick talks about outfitting Elektra's new studio on La Cienega Boulevard and going to Ann Arbor with Jac to meet and record the MC5, so apparently Botnick was on Elektra's payroll by at least mid-'68. This reminds me. I realize that "Jac" is short for "Jacob," but is it pronounced "Jake" or "Jack"? Jamie and JimmyC also mention: >n.p. Billy Spradlin's Girlpop @ live365.com - Great!!!!! I also recommend Billy's other Live365 station, Jangle Radio, if you like more contemporary guitar pop. And if I may be so immodest, my own live365 station, "The Craig Torso Show" (obscure Bonzo Dog Band ref) might pique some folks' interest. Focusing mostly on contemporary pop music obscure even by the standards of folks who go looking for obscure pop music on the net, the playlist also ranges from Sidney Bechet to John Cage. Not terribly Spectropoppish, but I like it. Stewart NP: Linda Perhacs -- Parallelograms (acid chamber folk from 1970, a beautiful, crystalline, and extremely odd album) --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- Subject: Come Dancin' !!! Received: 03/25/00 6:01 am From: Jimmy Cresitelli To: Spectropop! Just heard the Popsicles' "Baby I Miss You" on Mr. Spradlin's fabulous Girlpop station, and I think I am ready to join that angelic background chorus. As for the rest of you, I haven't seen much in the way of girl group moments here in a while, so... here's your Spring Challenge: describe for me your ONE defining girl-group musical moment. Not just a song, mind you: a piece of a song would suffice... for me it's Darlene Love opening up "A Fine, Fine Boy" with her spoken intro, putting just the right amount of oomph into "now there are boys, and there are boys..." Come on, the rest of you... details! We need to get dancing on here! --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- Subject: Re: Isn't She Great - is Bacharach still great? Received: 03/26/00 8:00 pm From: Frank N. Stein To: Spectropop! David Ponak wrote: >I'm one of the biggest Bacharach fans out there, I love >the guy, however, it pains me to tell you that the "Isn't >She Great" soundtrack is just unlistenable. This isn't the >Bacharach of "Painted From Memory," it's sounds more like >the work of the man who wrote "On My Own" and "That's What >Friends Are For." I saw the track listing and it's at least good that it's a proper soundtrack, with incidental music and a few songs inbetween. Just like in the old days. The production aside, how does the incidental music hold up to previous soundtracks like After The Fox or What's New Pussycat, or Arthur 2 for that matter? And the Dionne Warwick songs written by Burt and Hal? >DX7 keyboard sounds abound. The whole thing is very 80's MOR. So there aren't any orchestral, uh, orchestrations, with strings, flutes, horns and such? Just keyboards and synthesizers? >It makes me wonder if some of the great Bacharachisms of "Painted From Memory" >may have been created (or at least prompted) by Elvis Costello. Funny. Isn't this the same debate as the one which sometimes pops up about Brian Wilson? That Brian's talents have diminished, that he can't write anything good on his own, that his collaborators (Paley, VDP, Thomas, etc, etc) do most of the work? And at the same time, those collaborators always say "no no, Brian is still great and in charge, we just add a few things here and there"... Carol Kaye, did you only play on the released 1997 version of Brian's "Everything I Need" on the "The Wilsons" CD, or did you also play on the unreleased original (from 1995?)? The song is quite something, don't you think? Anyway, I'm pretty sure a lot of the things on Painted From Memory which sound like Bacharach were in fact written by Costello. But it's ok, really. Bacharach is over 70 years old. It'd be ridiculous to expect him to come up with music as innovative and great as thirty years ago. If he does, brilliant, but it's not the end of the world if he ends his career with a few misses. That's kind of how I feel about Brian too. --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- Subject: Nilsson's Coconuts Received: 03/24/00 8:00 am From: Sean Anglum To: Spectropop! Greetings All, Hope this ques is in with everyones wavelengths on this great list. I used to work at a NPR station that played alternative and, to a much lesser extent, some good rock and pop. One DJ, in particular, would occassionally plat a version of Harry Nilsson's "Coconuts" that I had never heard before. What set it apart was the ending. During the elongated fade, Harry and band and chorus broke in a breif version of "Flying", the instrumental from Magical Mystery Tour. Unfortunately the DJ was canned and must have taken that particular track (off an LP?? 12" single?? Foreign pressing??) with him. Please, please, please.....if anyone knows where I can find this gem e-mail me privately and fill me in on how to secure a copy. Thanx!! Raised On records, Sean Anglum --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------- End
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