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Spectropop V#0360

  • From: The Spectropop Group
  • Date: 12/21/99

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       Volume #0360                       December 22, 1999   
    Subject:     Musicianship!
    Received:    12/21/99 11:02 pm
    From:        DJ JimmyB, DJJimxxxxxcom
    To:          Spectropop List,
    In a message dated 12/19/99 7:17:13 PM, you wrote:
    >There's a reason why you don't hear the musicianship today
    Musicianship!  Hell, you don't even hear choruses, bridges or 
    melodies....mainly just grooves...fine for a little while, 
    Jimmy Botticelli
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     I'll Never Need More Than This
    Received:    12/22/99 1:27 am
    From:        jake tassell,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    Right Jamie!
     If they're gonna call us 'retentive' - then let them go 
    ahead, say I! My two different copies of 'INNMTT' are; the
    one on the A&M album which you referred to as the Larry 
    Levine stereo mix and another one on a single backed with 
    'A Love Like Yours....'; it's an English release on the 
    London label HLU10627, unusually for a London release - it
    has an orange label. It also says on the label GEMA which I
    don't know anything about, but my neighbour told me this 
    meant it was an 'export copy', no, I don't know what that 
    means either - export from where? To where? Maybe that has
    no significance at all. It also says;- Made in England by 
    the Decca Record Co. Ltd. It was found in my girlfriend's 
    father's attic along with a bunch of dreary Searchers 
    records and a couple of good Eden Kane and Heinz discs.
    But let's drop the red-herrings, superfluities and 
    anecdotals - I think this copy is probably just the 
    ordinary English release. On the single version, which is 
    mono, it's a tighter mix, the guitar section is more 
    prominent and there is definitely a ton-weight more 
    'chamber' on the vocal. I don't think it's just a straight 
    'squeeze and balance' job. I personally like both versions
    for different reasons. Because of the more compressed sound
    on the single it gives the illusion of being more fleet 
    than the album version, but I think they're both the same 
    speed and length. As I said before it also has a really 
    stupid amount of echo on it - which is always fun. The 
    'Levine' version has a lot more light and shade, height and
    depth - which I like a lot too. The original on Philles is 
    probably going to sound a bit different again as you know,
    because British and American sixties 45s were made out of 
    completely different kinds of vinyl. Now we're getting 
    into the the 'fine-wines' talk! American record-plastic at
    that time was much more brittle, had huge amounts of really
    unsubtle bass and treble reponse and kind of lacked finesse, 
    but it excelled in impact terms. The English vinyl was 
    less brittle and thus - mid-rangey and more 
    comprehensively fi oriented but it didn't mark up as much 
    oomph! Which is best? As all things, it depends what you 
    want. I tend to like US 45s on US vinyl and vice versa. I 
    know a lot of British musicians of the time were 
    disappointed that they couldn't get as much instant impact
    as they wanted from the UK stuff. Joe Meek was particularly
    frustrated with this, and when he went into cut 'Telstar' 
    he cut it so deep it nearly came out the other side! 
    That's why The Decca 'Telstar' is the loudest British 60s 
    45 you will find.......
    I have to apologise at this point and say that I really 
    want to write more but I have to go to the bank! Then I'm 
    off to the log-fire in Somerset for Christmas. To be 
    Wishing a Merry Christmas to All of You on The List - You
    Spectorial Revisionists, You!!!
    Jake Tassell
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     Re: Goffin/King Collection
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        David Bash,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    The Heavy Blinkers, wrote:
    > Hi there! I'm new to the list and I have a question
    > that I know you spectorophiles out there can answer
    > for me: Does there exist and where can one purchase a
    > Goffin/King box set (or simply a collection) covering
    > material that was given to other artists? Any help
    > would be GREATLY appreciated.
    >                thanks guys
    >                      Jason
    Hi Jason,
    One collection which might fulfill your needs, although it
    isn't devoted strictly to Goffin/King, is "On Broadway: Hit
    Songs And Rarities From The Brill Building Era", a 2 CD set
    released this year, on Westside Records. It's got 50 tracks, 
    all of which are tunes writeen by either Goffin/King, 
    Barry Greenwich, or Mann/Weil. It's a great collection, 
    and very reasonbly priced for an import. The sound is good, 
    the liners are good; I'm sure you'd love it! Check out 
    Westside at
    Jason, are you a member of the Canadian band The Heavy 
    Blinkers? If so, I like your CD, and just heard your Xmas 
    song, which I thought was excellent! 
    Spectropop Rules!!!!!
    Take Care,
    David Bash
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     RE: King/Goffin compilation
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        Mark Landwehr,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    > Does there exist and where can one purchase a
    > Goffin/King box set (or simply a collection) covering
    > material that was given to other artists? Any help
    > would be GREATLY appreciated.
    As for LPs, Jason, here are two hard-to-find compilations...
    Screen Gems-Columbia Music released to radio stations only
    an LP (CPL-713) of King/Goffin hits around 1970 featuring:
    Chains - Beatles(!)
    Halfway to Paradise - Tony Orlando
    Her Royal Majesty - James Darren
    Hey Girl - Freddie Scott
    Hi-De-Ho - Blood, Sweat and Tears
    I'm Into Something Good - Herman's Hermits
    Loco-Motion - Little Eva
    Oh No, Not My Baby - Maxine Brown
    One Fine Day - Chiffons
    Pleasant Valley Sunday - Monkees
    Take Good Care of My Baby - Bobby Vee
    Up On the Roof - Drifters
    Will You Love Me Tomorrow - Shirelles
    Later, an LP called "Solid Gold Programming from Screen 
    Gems/Colgems EMI Music Companies" included 2 records 
    filled with nothing but King/Goffin hits. Again, this was 
    a promo-only issue, featuring many of the same tunes as 
    the previously-mentioned LP, along with such goodies as: 
    Goin' Back - Byrds
    Will You Love Me Tomorrow - Dave Mason
    No Easy Way Down - Dusty Springfield
    Oh No, Not My Baby - Rod Stewart
    Locomotion - Grand Funk
    A Natural Woman - Aretha Franklin
    Every Breath I Take - Gene Pitney
    It Might As Well Rain Until September - Carole King
    and others....
    This is a goodie for the Spector-produced Pitney song, and,
    surprisingly, both LPs have the uncharted Beatles cover of 
    the Cookies' smash hit "Chains"...(Why didn't they put the 
    Cookies' version on these records??)
    Since both LPs were promo-only, I'm pretty sure they were 
    never commercially released later on CD/tape. That is, I'm 
    sure until someone says I'm wrong....
    Phil Spector Label Gallery - updated 
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     two areas
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        Michael B Kelly,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    I feel we are immensely fortunate to have Carol Kaye 
    contributing to Spectropop. I have two areas I would 
    appreciate her input on.
    1. You mentioned that "Brian was the ONLY one who had 
    semi-charts, parts for some instruments were totally 
    written out while other charts were just chord-charts." 
    What did Jan Berry bring, if anything?
    2. Rock and roll is generally said to be a fusion of R&B 
    and Country. I grew up listening to my father play Big 
    Band music and pop, and I always felt that was the third 
    leg of the table. Now you mention that the musicians were 
    all Jazz-oriented.
    So in your opinion was R&R a combination of R&B/Country/
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     Re: Spector Christmas in ((stereo))
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        WASE RADIO,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    Hi James:  
    I have a European CD that has the Spector Christmas songs 
    in stereo. But they also tacked on three Elvis songs. The 
    CD is simply called "Xmas Party". The sound quality varies. 
    Darlene Love's "White Christmas" sounds bassy. Elvis' 
    "Blue Christmas" is the same. The other tracks sound fine. 
    There are some differences in the mixes other than the 
    obvious stereo-mono ones. On the stereo mixes, the strings
    (heard on the right channel) are much louder. On the mono 
    mixes the strings are almost buried by the rhythm section.
    Also the stereo versions that fade does so earlier than on 
    the mono versions. I'll try to find out the label for you.
    But again the CD is called "Xmas Party". The front cover 
    depicts a swiss chalet at night covered in snow. And over 
    the picture are publicity photos of Elvis and all the 
    Spector artists. 
    Good Luck 
    Michael G. Marvin 
    WASE radio
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     Living at the other end of the channel tunnel
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        Frank,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    jake tassell wrote:
    >Dear Spectropop
    >...made me think a lot about The 
    >Spector influence on the English and Continental-European 
    >production styles of that time. 
    >The British ignorance of any Continental-European 
    >tradition in pop music before or since reflects fairly 
    >well the complete lack of identification with its 
    >geographical proximity. This is partly a cultural divide, 
    >but also simply to do with language difference. Since the 
    >channel-tunnel opened you can now get to Paris from London
    >quicker than you can get to Liverpool or Manchester;- but 
    >hardly anyone in England has heard of Francoise Hardy, 
    >Serge Gainsbourg, France Gall etc. and apart from the 
    >aforementioned artists, my knowledge of sixties 
    >continental pop is fairly limited too. Any of you Spectros
    >got any good recommendations? 
    Dear Jake,
    Interesting subject you bring up there. Living at the 
    other end of the channel tunnel and having been raised and
    bathed in US and British music in the 60's, I was lucky 
    enough to see live and later on meet most of the great 
    artists you mention from the Beatles to Andrew Oldham, and
    of course all of the French artists you mention (I'm still 
    very good friend with France Gall). 
    However I' m sorry to have to say that in my opinion there
    was never anything in France that could be compared to the 
    Wall Of Sound. It's true that the British scene really 
    knew who Phil Spector was and what he was doing (I can 
    still remember the ecstatic opinion Paul and John had 
    about River Deep Mountain High) and also, true there were 
    quite interesting pseudo WOS productions done in the UK 
    (certainly the Walker Bros. were one instance and Andrew 
    Oldham was probably the No. 1 Phil Spector fan), but as far 
    as France was concerned : nothing.
    I know at one point, Francoise Hardy had some following in
    Britain but this had probably more to do with her look that
    was pure Carnaby Street than anything else and certainly 
    not with any relations to the WOS. 
    You must remember that back in the 60s when French pop 
    started (with artists like Johnny Halliday, Eddy Mitchell,
    Sylvie Vartan...) it was 99% covers of US and British hits,
    nothing else. Artists and producers only tried to copy, as 
    faithfully as they could, the sound they heard on the 
    English speking hits. As a result we had all those French 
    translations of most of the Phil Spector songs (even River
    Deep Mountain High) and practically all the other hits of 
    the time that you can think of. All I can say is that (99%
    (again) of these covers were tragic. And it's interesting 
    to note that the only French artists who survived this 
    period veered from covers to original songs definitely 
    much more interesting.
    This being said there were of course hundreds of French 
    singers and groups to suddenly come out of nowhere at the 
    time and they are much more listenable now than then. 
    Probably a nostalgic effect, so if you're interested 
    in anything in particular, I'll be glad to help.
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     Video
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        Carol Kaye,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    A fan just emailed this to me, tho't you might like to see
    it, tho't they were done showing those videos (permanently 
    archived now in the Paul Allen Experience Museum in 
    Seattle, due to open June 2000, I just was up there 
    recording bass sounds on their old instruments for them, 
    great people with this company, EMP):
    The Message:
    I just visited the "Experience Music Project" page and 
    found a video clip of Carol et al at McCabe's. Woo-hoo, I 
    finally get to see them in action! Check it out at:
    Carol, why didn't you tell us it was there???
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     News 
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        Carol Kaye,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    Here's something I just received from Alan Boyd, a very 
    wonderful person as is the great Mark Linnet, fine 
    engineer with wonderful integrity:
    >Just tonight Mark Linett and I finished mastering a 
    >special Beach Boys CD for Capitol Records, a "bonus" disc 
    >that will be given to folks who buy the new greatest hits 
    >packages. I've tried to structure it a little like a movie, 
    >I guess, interspersing bits of dialog, studio chatter, 
    >and even some very early home recordings at the Wilson 
    >house with alternate/unreleased versions of songs that are
    >either in the movie or on one of the greatest hits CD's. 
    >It turned out quite nicely, and I think fans will really 
    >go for it. Mark Linett is an amazing engineer, a real 
    >perfectionist, and he did some magic with those old tapes.
    Mark is the nicest guy in the business and the most honest
    too.....altho' some ugly bootlegger tried to slander him 
    awhile back, I can vouch for Mark, a terrific guy.
    Carol Kaye
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     Against the law to post contracts
    Received:    12/21/99 11:02 pm
    From:        Carol Kaye,
    To:          Spectropop List,
    FYI Brad Elliott, it's against the law to post any of our 
    Musicians' Union contracts, or at least our Union 
    threatened a lawsuit against someone who recently tried to
    do that, SSN's or not you shouldn't be putting any 
    contract on the url. And I have a message out to Russ 
    Wapensky who usually replies to me quickly on what he told
    me about this.
    "Drums" can mean percussion and "Guitar" can mean elec. 
    bass on the contracts -- so now you know that contracts 
    are not to be literally taken unless you are in the music 
    business and know the difference of what is meant by the 
    different ways of handling the IDing of instruments. They 
    even have me playing "bongoes" on many of the Ray Charles 
    contracts, hahahaha!
    Will get right back to you all as to what Russ says.
    >From Brad:  
    >He's the third musician listed. Carol is, by the way,
    >the ninth name on the contract.  
    Well darn, I'm "heartbroken", they should have had me 
    first!   :-)
    Carol Kaye
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
    Subject:     Re: Only Hal Blaine on drums
    Received:    12/21/99 11:03 pm
    From:        Dave Mirich, Dmxxxxxcom
    To:          Spectropop List,
    Brad Elliot wrote in part:
    >  << Jeez, I really hate to be put in the position of disputing
    >   Carol Kaye, but in this instance, I'm afraid she's wrong. 
    >   and:
    >   Well, if you check the sessionography in the PET SOUNDS 
    >   SESSIONS booklet, which "was compiled using research 
    >   generously supplied by music historian Russ Wapensky," 
    >   you'll see that he too credits Frost with drums on "Pet 
    >   Sounds" (AKA "Run James Run"). If Russ now disputes that, 
    >   I'd be interested in learning why.
    >   Surf's up! Brad
    Brad. Your response to Carol felt overly harsh to me, in 
    contrast to the style and manner normally shown by 
    discussants on this list. I feel it was unnecessary for 
    you to flatly state that she was wrong on this small point. 
    There may be additional information that surfaces 
    sometime in the future to support her memory of this item 
    of discussion. I would rather you had couched your 
    comments in the context that, "It must be next to 
    impossible to keep track of those thousands of dates and 
    hundred of thousands of details -- but here is the 
    information I have unearthed on this point."
    Dave Mirich
    --------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------

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