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Volume #0205 January 5, 1999
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Stereo has Come of Age
Subject: Christmas Kisses
Sent: 12/30/18 1:35 am
Received: 01/02/99 8:16 pm
From: Ron Bierma, ELROXXXXXXXXom
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
In a message dated 1/2/99 1:39:53 AM, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com writes:
<<I heard a "new" Xmas tune on the radio this year. The DJ did not
give the title or artist, but it was a GG-type record, probably
titled "Christmas Kisses." Sounded a bit like Joanie Sommers.
Anyone know the record, either from the early '60s or from a new
compilation?>>
Capitol put out a collection of "Christmas Classics from
Capitol's Early Years" back in 1990 called "Christmas Kisses"
containing the song "Christmas Kisses" by Ray Anthony & the
Bookends. liners say recorded 10/19/61-take 14-released 12/4/61
(Capitol 4446). The CD # is 94701, but I don't know if it was
released again this year or not. That's my guess. RB
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Subject: no cavemen are mentioned
Sent: 01/05/19 5:30 pm
Received: 01/04/99 8:27 am
From: Jeffrey Glenn, jeffrey_gXXXXXXXXil.com
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
>I heard a "new" Xmas tune on the radio this year. The DJ did not
>give the title or artist, but it was a GG-type record, probably
>titled "Christmas Kisses." Sounded a bit like Joanie Sommers.
>Anyone know the record, either from the early '60s or from a new
>compilation?
>
>
>Doc
Hi Doc,
The record you heard was indeed called "Christmas Kisses" by Ray
Anthony (yes, he of "Hokey Pokey" and "Bunny Hop" fame - or
infame, depending on your point of view!:-)) & the Bookends. It
was written by J. Kruger and H. Gilden and released on Capitol
4667 (45) on December 4, 1961. It was recorded on October 19,
1961 (Take 14) and carries Master #36626. Don't know what the
B-side is however.
This info comes from the notes of a 1990 Capitol 21-track
compilation on which it appears called CHRISTMAS KISSES -
CHRISTMAS CLASSICS FROM CAPITOL'S EARLY YEARS. The catalog number
is CDP 7 94701 2; and I don't know if it's still in print. The
version on the CD is a first ever stereo mix (ADD).
You're right with the Joanie Sommers reference (although no
cavemen are mentioned in this one:-)). It's a pretty cool song!
Hope this helps.
Jeff
np: Richard Harris - THE WEBB SESSIONS 1968-1969
The Retros Home Page:
http://members.tripod.com/~Jeffrey_Glenn/index.html
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Subject: Herb Alpert & the Ventures
Sent: 01/02/99 8:38 pm
Received: 01/02/99 8:56 pm
From: Jamie LePage, le_pageXXXXXXXXties.com
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
Carol wrote:
>I've known Herb Alpert since he was working at Keen Records
>with Bumps Blackwell.... He is an EXCELLENT producer, really
>knows his craft.
>
>I even did a "jazz gig" ... with Herb on trumpet, and well.....
>he's great at producing!
Several months ago we were discussing Herb Alpert on this list.
He's usually mentioned favorably by his contemporaries and the
people who recorded with him. Surely Herb is a "music man."
I recall reading somewhere that Herb Alpert sometimes used a
different trumpet player on some of his peak era TJ Brass
productions. Did you ever hear anything about that, Carol?
----------
In an earlier digest Carol Kaye wrote:
>...some of the Ventures played on their recordings but that's
>myself on bass and Hal Blaine on drums, etc.
That's interesting. There are a probably a few Ventures fans out
there who are surprised to read that. The Ventures recording
career spans decades. Can you recall any song titles or albums or
which years you played on the Ventures, Carol?
I recall Mel Taylor gleefully explaining the Ventures method of
record making; they would scan the bottom of Billboard Hot 100
for new instrumentals. Whenever they found one "bubbling under"
or "picked-to-click" they would rush off to record it and get it
released before the original had a chance to hit. They'd put it
on an album with big letters proclaiming the song's title, and
voila. The public thought Ventures were the original. This of
course was a clever trick that made the Ventures and their label
a lot of money, and I admire the Ventures for their enterprising
spirit.
Sometimes I wonder if this had an adverse effect on the original
artists and producers. Case in point is the Tornados' "Telstar."
The first UK 45 to reach #1 in US (long before the Beatles), the
Ventures had the Telstar/Lonely Bull album out before Joe Meek
could mutter "Rotten Pigs!" Taylor explained that even though the
Tornados had the #1 on Billboard, the Ventures sold ten times more
Telstar records in US than Tornados did. To my ears, the Ventures'
Telstar is a decent cover and their Telstar/Lonely Bull album is
mildly inspired, but the original Tornados 45 and LP are works of
genius. There are similar Ventures stories in connection with
Pipeline, Apache, etc. - even today many believe the Ventures'
recorded the original versions of these songs.
We all know there were a lot of sound-a-like knock-offs made in
the 60's. Those knock-offs aren't necessarily all bad by
definition. Some are apparently collectible as Paul Urbahns
mentioned with regard to Jerry Fuller. Still, I wonder why much
of the Ventures recorded repertoire is not more widely regarded
today as knock-offs.
--
All the best,
Jamie LePage <le_pageXXXXXXXXties.com>
--------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]--------------------
Subject: Various
Sent: 12/29/18 10:23 pm
Received: 01/02/99 8:16 pm
From: Carol Kaye, carolXXXXXXXXlink.net
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
Subject: Larry Levine
Yes, Phil especially loved to work with Larry Levine, who loves
Phil a lot. I attended a breakfast a few months ago with Larry,
Dave Gold, Perry Botkin, George Tipton, and Stan Ross (others too)
and Larry, no matter what, will ALWAYS stick up for Phil (even
about the Darlene Love lawsuit -- Stan Ross will too for that
matter, Stan did the very first Phil Spector dates, and then went
to Hawaii and so Larry did them after that in the beginning of
Phil's 60s dates).
Larry designed the A&M studios also for Herb Alpert, Larry just
plays golf these days mostly.
Subject: Jerry Fuller/Gary Puckett
There was a LOT of studio-musician creative input
arrangement-wise for the Gary Puckett & Union Gap dates, I'm on
most (if not all) of those, OK, that rings a bell about Jerry now
too. You do forget who did what on a lot of those dates, and I do
remember working also "just" for Gary Puckett. He had only the
BEST of the studio musicians on his dates, creating arrangement
ideas too. He relied on musician ideas - Jerry Fuller did too.
Subject: Barry White/Jim Messina
Yes, I do remember working for Barry White, am on his hit
recordings cut I believe late 60s, very NICE NICE man. Barry
White was great to work for, very appreciative and above the call
of just the niceties, he truly loved the musicians.
And in fact, I just got a "hello" from him through a mutual
friend when we were recording the interview for the Brian Wilson
A&E biography (will be out late spring, they just started
shooting last Nov.). Was a pleasant surprise.
I just re-read one post about Barry White, and it listed Jim
Messina in the credits. Boy, I didn't know that.
When you're doing 2-3-4 dates a day, you usually work with the
regular studio musicians, but once in awhile a new guy will be
there (maybe part of the traveling band with that artist or?). So
yes, that could have gotten by me. Am surprised as I've always
been an admirer of Jim......but of course this had to be before
he did his own thing.
Subject: Union payments for reuses
Yes, we do get an annual royalty Union check for movies and all
re-used hit recordings in those movies. I have about 200 movies
on my annual list that pay every year (it varies slightly
according to which are used on "free" TV), but 100s more are cut
but are either probably on the cable list (no royalty paid for
cable) or the Union simply can't "collect" the monies etc.
Most of the films are movie scores I did, but a few like "Ghost",
"Top Gun" "Good Morning Vietnam", etc. are re-uses of our 60s hits,
I didn't play on those scores except for that. You get a
nominal re-use sum then a little bit per picture each year, no
biggie, but every bit helps.
Subject: That Motown Thing
Now....about the Motown thing. Originally, I complained to the
Union in the late 80s about the fact that we get "no royalties",
as we did go "legal" with Motown about 1967 (when they announced
they had "moved to LA".
Along came the use of "My Girl", very popular in the last 10 yrs.
in movies, TV shows, etc. Bill Peterson, pres. of our Union, MADE
up a contract, relying on people's testimony that they did that
tune (which I always thought was a Detroit product). Some of our
LA horn men are listed on that contract.
Over the years, Russ Wapensky, writer of the contract credits
book, did find the "Get Ready" contract (we did do some "legal"
dates out here in the 60s), with my name on it playing bass and
of course the G.I.T. On Broadway Television special (with Diana
Ross and the Tempts) cut at NBC with Al Lapin as contractor is a
matter of record (think that was late 68), with my name not only
on the contract but trumpeter Ollie Mitchell even has that on his
movie camera (on super 8 film) and almost had his camera
conviscated when Diana Ross got angry (boy she had some energy
I'll tell you).
So NO, they did not play on the credits I (we) claim (and I
totally remember the music, the parts I made up some of the ideas
written in the 1st bar, etc., some of the incidents surrounding
the cutting of those dates).
It makes sense -- the LA studio musicians who were responsible
for the 60s greatest hits that have lasted this long, were NOT
hired to do demos and album fillers for Motown - I have 113 dates
logged in my log, plus my sound is distinctive altho' Armin
Steiner (who also verified that we cut a ton of Motown 60s hits
here in LA in a magazine interview) tried to add compression a
little to try to "match" Jamerson's sound (hear my soundbytes on
"Bernadette" and "I Was Made To Love Her", sounds like "fingers"
doesn't it).
Even Berry Gordy said it in his 1964 filmed interview, bragging
about all the "great tracks coming out of LA for Motown."
Well......I'd think people could put 2 and 2 together, when
people used the hit making factory studio musicians of LA -- it
was not for "demos". We heard "demos" cut in Detroit (but played
by Armin who told me about all the plane-flights back to Detroit),
played to give us a "feel" for the records which we cut out
here.
I spoke to Lester Sill about this about in 1991 or so, as he was
president of Jobete for Berry for many, many years. He said (and
I quote), "Carol, you all didn't cut 30-35% of Motown's 60s
original HIT tracks out here in the 60s, it was over 60% of all
of Motown's biggest hits and you played bass on most of them."
When I tried to counter with "Lester, I thought it was only 30%
to 1/3 of Motown", he got angry, and re-stated "60%!" Well...I
still don't know, don't think anyone will ever be able to prove
it.
There are some films made where we talk about Motown, and there
have been a few magazine articles in the past where, besides
Armin Steiner, Earl Palmer, Joe Sample, even Steve Douglas, etc.
talked about Motown.
We will never see a dime of that money, and I don't think that
Berry Gordy is interested in setting the record straight.
Motown was started by the 2nd wife of Berry Gordy, herself a
talented arranger/pianist/composer, who got the groups started in
Detroit, filed the corporation papers for Motown, it was all her
idea. But Berry got it away from her when they split up, she went
to NY, and the year? 1963, when we really got into gear out here
in LA. There's more but from what I know etc., that will be put
together very well in my book.
I also used to hear from Berry Gordy from time to time a "hello"
too through a mutual friend of Don Costa's brother who was
engineer for Berry for many many years (died about 1 year ago).
BTW, Bill Peterson played trumpet on some of those cash dates for
Motown, and we spoke about the "demo singers' mike not being
plugged in all the time" (indicating "tracks" for singing to be
later added on), he also worked the "later cash dates" where they
tried to use the 2 white girls (for the Supremes tracks) who
couldn't sing at all, they were terrible singers, nice girls but
couldn't sing.
We knew it was a all a sham, but who wouldn't jump at the chance.
Lew McCreary used to say "we were making history w/Motown, that's
why I did it", yes, our musicians are all angry about it. It's our
fault though that we let them get away with it for years (instead
of 3-4 months like we did with other "new" record companies for
whom we'd do a few "demos" and if they hit (which they usually
did), then we'd bring them into the Union by insisting they had
to have us "Union" on their recordings). God's truth.
I had one guy put his computer tracking sound gear on my
"Bernadette" bass line soundbyte on my website (I recut my
original bass part note for note in 1994, was able to re-create
the exact feel and notes I originally played on the 4 Tops
recording), thinking he's going to "catch me" as he was a
Jamerson fan.
He emailed me about it some months ago and was so apologetic, he
said "they match, the attack, the...." whatever he said,
something about the technical stuff -- he was flabbergasted. He
couldn't say enough beautiful words about how it was "me" on
Bernadette when all along, he thought it was Jamerson, etc.
So eventually they will be able to prove us. We know we did many
of the hit tracks, I still think it was about 35-40% though, but
some very important hits for Motown.
Subject: Bobby Goldsboro
I played bass on "Honey" and that "Leaving the Straight Life
Behind" (correct title?) by Bobby Goldsboro, and did "Little
Green Apples" and "Hickory Hollar" with O.C. Smith - both O.C.
and Bobby Goldsboro loved that small studio at Columbia, where we
also did dates with Andy Williams (H. B. Barnum arranger for O.C.
Smith, H.B. also did a lot of Motown hits too). Well anyway, I'm
lucky I had a studio career, I could have stayed in playing jazz
and had a really tough life. Or I should say "tougher".
Happy New Year,
Carol Kaye
http://www.carolkaye.com/
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Subject: Phil Spector masters in good hands?
Sent: 12/29/18 3:25 am
Received: 01/04/99 8:27 am
From: Paul Urbahns, PaulurXXXXXXXXom
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
In a message dated 1/2/99 1:39:53 AM Eastern Standard Time,
spectrXXXXXXXXties.com writes:
>Thankfully the Spector masters are in good hands now. ;-)
>
Last I heard they were in Phil's hands, that's not good because
his partner is Allen Klein who has been sitting on Cameo-Parkway
stuff for years. I don't understand why they only limitly release
stuff. If I owned it they would be on every oldies comp issued,
just like Duke Of Earl. Whoever owns that song is making a
fortune. The more copies sold the more money you make as either
record company or songwriter and Phil is in on both. Even though
new releases are out under Phil Spector Records logo, I heard he
never closed down Philles. Any truth to that rumor?
Paul Urbahns
paulurXXXXXXXXom
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Subject: Session players royalities
Sent: 12/29/18 1:25 am
Received: 01/04/99 8:27 am
From: Paul Urbahns, PaulurXXXXXXXXom
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
Doc Rock asked
>And you mentioned Motown songs being in films. Do session players
>get royalties for that? I never thought they did, but do they?
Paul Urbahns comments:
I interviewed Boots Randolph several times and he did mention
once that he played on Dolly Parton's record 9 to 5 and he still
gets royalities from the movie that used the song. Of course he
played on most of the early Elvis Presley soundtracks including
Blue Hawaii and he didn't mention getting checks for them, but I
never thought to ask.
Paul Urbahns
paulurXXXXXXXXom
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Subject: They seek Ry Cooder here, they seek Ry Cooder
there..../Burt Bacharach
Sent: 01/08/19 4:41 am
Received: 01/04/99 8:27 am
From: The Elf Who Could Not Love, MUV9XXXXXXXXnt2.lu.se
To: Spectropop List, spectrXXXXXXXXties.com
Went to see my dad for a couple of days and he told me a funny
thing; a guy at his work is the cousin of Ry Cooder!! Pretty much
shows how small the world can be sometimes, eh?
Xmas gifts, Xmas gifts....did anyone get any special records? I
got Burt Bacharach's "What's New Pussycat?" OST which is pretty
good and in the same style as his two other comedy filmscores,
After The Fox and Casino Royale. The only real disappointment is
the length of the CD (29 minutes) --- yet it's an expensive
full-price record. A bit of a rip off if you ask me!
Speaking of Bacharach, I'm waiting for the new Box Set to arrive
in the mail and I'm surprised it hasn't been discussed on the
list yet (the Box Set, that is, not me waiting for it to arrive
in the mail :-)). Has anyone bought it yet? What tracks are the
highlights? With 85 songs, it looks like every Bacharach-fan's
wet dream :)
Carol Kaye, did you ever work with Bacharach? I think he recorded
in LA, atleast....I hear he's quite a perfectionist in the studio
too. All those bizarre time signatures and chord progressions not
to mention the constant key changes must've been pretty hard to
follow for the studio musicians sometimes, no?
Tobias
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