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Spectropop - Digest Number 690



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                        Jamie LePage (1953-2002)
                  http://www.spectropop.com/Jamie.htm
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There are 15 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future"
           From: Keith Beach 
      2. The Pearls
           From: Eric Charge 
      3. Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future"
           From: Richard Williams 
      4. Re: "Lovers" authorship / new goodie
           From: Kingsley Abbott 
      5. Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future"
           From: Phil Milstein 
      6. Re: Bobby Russell / That English sound
           From: Antonio Vizcarra 
      7. Re: Jeff Barry, pre and post-1966
           From: Stuffed Animal 
      8. Re: Bo Diddley launches new website
           From: Guy Lawrence 
      9. Re: Shangri-Las: My View
           From: Mark Frumento 
     10. Re:Jay & the Techniques / Gary Criss / Martha Reeves
           From: Bob Rashkow 
     11. Re: Toni Wine's "Sisters In Sorrow"
           From: Allan Rinde 
     12. Caroline, Mel, Françoise..... and Verdelle
           From: Phil Chapman 
     13. Re: Bobby Russell / That English sound
           From: Jeff Lemlich 
     14. Re: Gary Criss with a Barry-Greenwich song
           From: Mike Edwards 
     15. Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future"
           From: Phil Milstein >


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Message: 1
   Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:58:02 -0000
   From: Keith Beach 
Subject: Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future"

Shouldn't we be giving Jerry Leiber extra credit for writing 
lyrics that suggest so much but explain so little? Plus it's 
spoken not sung, so effectively it's a monologue not a song.
I bet he was so pleased to come up with the phrase "that will 
never...happen...again"

However I would like him to explain the meaning (and circumstances) 
of the lyrics to "Honey, can I put on your clothes".

Keith Beach



-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 2 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 09:42:22 -0000 From: Eric Charge Subject: The Pearls I have had a good ticking off for daring to suggest that the Holland/Dozier/Holland song "Third Finger Left Hand" is best interpreted by Britain's own Pearls. Mind you, I did this over on the Motown site (oops). The Martha & the Vandellas original sounds like a demo to me - not one of HDH's best efforts with the group. The Pearls song captured the twee sentiments perfectly. I also liked other Pearls records (covers of Ronettes and Stylistics records, I seem to recall). Now, I know we have experts here who can offer pearls of wisdom about this homegrown group. I want to know who they are and whether there is - or will be - a CD collection available. Thanks E x -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 3 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 10:14:30 +0000 From: Richard Williams Subject: Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future" I'm enjoying the exchanges on "Past Present and Future", but isn't the whole point about the appeal of such a song that it refuses to tell us everything? That's the difference between prose and poetry, and it's why so many two and a half minute songs from the 1960s have such lasting resonance. The writers didn't try to get everything in, nobody made them, and the fact that key narrative elements were often omitted sometimes enabled them to create emotions that didn't necessarily have names. Richard Williams -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 4 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 11:05:40 -0000 From: Kingsley Abbott Subject: Re: "Lovers" authorship / new goodie Phil was wondering about the authorship of The Ronettes' "Lovers"...a few years back, when she was on the promo trip for her version of "Don't Worry Baby" for Creation Records, I got the chance to interview Ronnie for Record Collector and I asked her specifically about this track. At first she didn't recall it, but when I sang a few bars to her (a better definition of desperation you'd be hard pressed to find), she recalled it and said that she thought that was one that Phil had written by himself. I'd certainly value Toni's opinion - maybe Phil started it, they worked on it a bit, and then it got put on one side as a work-in-progress perhaps... Here's a luvverly newie one for the season...one that is dedicated to Jamie... As I write, the new Lisa Mychols CD "Lost Winter's Dream" is on its third straight play. This is without doubt a pre-Xmas treat for all Spectropoppers - don't wait to be given it on the 25th! Lisa has written it, and worked with Darian and Nick from the Wondermints, so there are lovely little musical quotes all over it. If you like bells, glocks and big drum thumps....Several tracks stand out: the title track (also in track and girlie ooohs b.vox form, especially for Elizabeth!) which immediately recalls The Rag Dolls to my ears, "Listen To the Bells Ring", "Blizzard Of Aaahs", "x-Mass = Tyme" and "Christmas Came Too Soon". It's just out on Revola as CR REV 17 - Revola have a new website just up: http://www.revola.co.uk Kingsley -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 5 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 09:16:30 +0000 From: Phil Milstein Subject: Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future" Phil Chapman wrote: > Dude?? - The lyrics are not gender specific. With her charted > history of relationships ending in tragedy, she might have put > her trust in a same-sex partner, her analyst, or who knows how > sinister? All we do know is that something happened to a > relatively normal girl that could have permanently impaired her > capacity to form a lasting relationship. Well, that was the > Disappointer Sisters' alternative stage interpretation. Shadow > might have been amused. And I always thought it was just an old ragdoll that Billie Jo threw off the Tallahatchee Bridge. At the moment it doesn't look good, --Phil M. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 6 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 17:48:02 +0100 From: Antonio Vizcarra Subject: Re: Bobby Russell / That English sound Hi Spectropoppers, I have in my collection an album which has always been something of a mystery to me. It's entitled "That English Sound" and It's the usual low-budget compilation of the era featuring covers of hits like "We can work it out", "As tears go by", "Mrs brown you´ve got a lovely daughter" and so on. It was released on the Modern Sound label, produced by William Beasley and probably appeared around 1967. However, this LP also includes 3 really brilliant songs, which I don't think were covers of current hits, and that sound more American than British. They also sound as if they had been recorded around 1963/1964. The titles of the songs are as follows: "You make the decisions", "Just give me time" (A Brian Wilson soundalike song with falsetto harmonies) and "Bless you little girl" (a slow Mersey influenced number). As the record was pressed in Nashville and I think Bobby Russell wrote also a song called "Bless you little girl", could these three songs be connected somehow with Bobby Russell? Or are they simply regional hits that were included in the album along with more popular hits? Any information is really welcomed :-) Thanks in advance and all the best. Antonio -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 7 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 17:14:43 +0000 From: Stuffed Animal Subject: Re: Jeff Barry, pre and post-1966 Mick: > Curious: the fact that no Red Bird recordings featured in Stuffed > Animal's recent list of Essential Jeff Barry Productions. An > oversight, one presumes. If not, oh well, chacun a son gout! It bears pointing out here that my list was a list of album productions, not singles. If your favorite Raindrops/Dixie Cups/Shangri-Las single wasn't included, that's why. As for early Jeff Barry album productions like THE RAINDROPS, The Dixie Cups' CHAPEL OF LOVE, and The Shangri-Las' albums, much as I love them, I don't believe that they represent the best of his production work (not to mention the fact that the tracks were often co-produced by Joe Jones, Leiber and Stoller, Shadow Morton, etc)! As I said years ago in my Goldmine article, "Recipe for Rock and Roll," Jeff Barry didn't come into his own as a producer until he started working with Neil Diamond. True, Ellie Greenwich co-produced those sessions, but if you compare Neil Diamond's Bang sides with Jeff's later productions for people like Bobby Bloom, Andy Kim and Ron Dante, it's obvious that Jeff's production style was dominant on Neil's records. That's when his gospel- style rhythm sections (i. e. handclappings and tambourines) really came to the fore. I'm certainly not saying that his early album productions are not worth collecting! Far from it . . . but in my opinion, the studio work Jeff did between 1965 and 1980 is his BEST work. Everything that came before was a warm-up. Stuffed Animal -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 8 Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:05:41 -0800 From: Guy Lawrence Subject: Re: Bo Diddley launches new website David Blakey wrote: > Bo Diddley, one of the founding fathers of rock & roll and the > popularizer of the world-famous "Bo Diddley beat", has announced > that he will be launching his new website this coming Thanksgiving. Is that the same David Blakey who used to dispense marvellous second hand records and musical wisdom from a little white cottage deep in the English countryside? Regards, Guy. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 9 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 00:00:23 -0000 From: Mark Frumento Subject: Re: Shangri-Las: My View As a pure amateur compared to many of you in this field, having already raved endlessly here about the Shangri-Las CD on RPM, and having been inspired by the recent posts to listen one more time... here's my two cents worth: Technically speaking (whatever that means) "Out In The Streets" is probably their best song (at least in my opinion). However, among the many values of the RPM package is that the stereo version of at least one song seems to bring some new attention to it: "The Train From Kansas City." The stereo is fabulous and I'd say it's a strong contender for "the Shangri-Las best." Of the rest, well, I'm astonished that "Love You More Than Yesterday" was just a B-side! Mark (still in love with "the picture") -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 10 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 19:10:01 -0500 From: Bob Rashkow Subject: Re:Jay & the Techniques / Gary Criss / Martha Reeves Thanks to those who provided the info on Jay & The Techniques' early 70s recordings. They're one of my favorites but I only know up through "Singles Game", August 1968. I may be somewhat obvious here but Gary Criss was the voice of The Glass Bottle on Avco-Embassy who had a chart with "Ain't Got Time Anymore" in the fall of 1971. I also have their (admittedly not as interesting) "Don't it Make You Feel So Good" presumably from a few months later. What I didn't know was that he did Our Favorite Melodies on the Diamond label (where is it, where is it, where is it). I agree about Standing In The Shadows Of Motown that the focus was and should have been on the late James Jamerson, Robert White, et al. Still...wouldn't some of us have loved to hear Martha Reeves get into "I'm Ready For Love" or "Quicksand" just to name two!!! Bobster -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 11 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 20:49:51 -0000 From: Allan Rinde Subject: Re: Toni Wine's "Sisters In Sorrow" Country Paul wrote: > And to Allan Rinde for Toni Wine: I have Toni's "Sisters of > Sorrow" on Colpix. Am I really hearing it right as a song > about bigamy?!? Great refrain on this record! Toni says: "Sisters In Sorrow" (which was actually a 1970 ATCO release, and also cut by Brenda Lee) is not a song about bigamy. Glad you liked it, though. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 12 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 01:10:06 -0000 From: Phil Chapman Subject: Caroline, Mel, Françoise..... and Verdelle [Just before this thread's totally dead....] Martin wrote: > ...Mel Carter's "Tar And Cement", very good. Although as > far as the 'Battle Of The Bands' goes; close but just not > close enough. Caroline Munro gets the gold! David: > I agree with that. Caroline gets my vote too in the Battle > of the Bands. However, neither version is a patch on the > Françoise Hardy version "La Maison Ou J'Ai Grandi". > Wonderful, wonderful recording. It's a close call, but for me THE version is by Verdelle Smith. There's something appropriately poignant about her voice (have a listen in musica). Although as you say David, Françoise's is a wonderful recording, she has taken the route of the stark original by Adriano Celentano (currently available on CD), and I prefer the Vance-Pockriss arrangement. However, I could be influenced by having first heard the song around the time of being rehoused to a 'greener' area during 60s UK industrial slum-clearance, kind of "Tar & Cement" in reverse. Phil -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 13 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 05:26:37 -0000 From: Jeff Lemlich Subject: Re: Bobby Russell / That English sound Antonio Vizcarra wrote: > ...the Modern Sound label album "That English Sound". This LP also > includes 3 really brilliant songs, which I don't think were covers > of current hits, and that sound more American than British. They > also sound as if they had been recorded around 1963/1964. The > titles of the songs are as follows: "You make the decisions", "Just > give me time" (A Brian Wilson soundalike song with falsetto > harmonies) and "Bless you little girl" (a slow Mersey influenced > number). As the record was pressed in Nashville and I think Bobby > Russell wrote also a song called "Bless you little girl", could > these three songs be connected somehow with Bobby Russell? "Bless You Little Girl" was written by Bergen White; he gets credit for it on the Hit label single (#180) by "Bobby & Buddy". I guess he's Buddy here, because that's definitely him singing. I have not heard "Just Give Me Time", but from your description I'd be willing to bet that's another Bergen White vocal. (It, too, originally came out under the artist name "Bobby & Buddy", this time on Hit 162. If you're getting the impression Bobby Russell and Bergen White are all over this album, you are correct!) I am not familiar with "You Make The Decisions". Sadly, I do not have "That English Sound", but I am the proud owner of "From Britain With Beat" (Modern Sound 544), a kitsch classic that features an amazing cover shot of four ho-dads wearing long moppish wigs. The tracks consist of previously-released "Hit" label singles by the likes of the Doodles, Roamers, Beagles, Chords, Jalopy Five, Beasts, Ed Hardin, and Jackie & The Giants. I can confirm at least four Bobby Russell lead vocals on this album ("I Want To Hold Your Hand", "Satisfaction", "Sha La La", and "Broken Hearted Sad & Blue"), all four of them tracks that came out initially under four different artist names. Bobby also wrote the track "Come On On", which was first released as "Jackie & The Giants" on Hit 209, but later appeared (in this same form) on albums by the Chords and the Now Generation. Bobby's original tunes stand as probably the most recycled Hit/Modern Sound tracks of all, kind of funny when you consider they were still being recycled when he was hitting it big writing "The Joker Went Wild", "Honey", and "Little Green Apples". Jeff Lemlich http://www.limestonerecords.com -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 14 Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2002 03:07:27 -0000 From: Mike Edwards Subject: Re: Gary Criss with a Barry-Greenwich song Bob Rashkow writes: > I may be somewhat obvious here but Gary Criss was the voice of The > Glass Bottle on Avco-Embassy who had a chart with "Ain't Got Time > Anymore" in the fall of 1971...What I didn't know was that he did > "Our Favorite Melodies"... Great input, Bob, because I knew he did "Our Favorite Melodies", but knew nothing about his involvement with the Glass Bottle on Avco. Looks like GB gave him his only US chart entries, as there is nothing listed under his own name despite a run of nice 45s for Diamond in the early 60s. I found a Barry-Greenwich song, "Pretty Thing", by Gary on Avco and have posted it to musica. It is from 1972 and is arranged by Bill Ramal who did the arrangements on the Diamond sides. 1962's "Our Favorite Melodies' was written by Wes Farrell and Bob Elgin and the b-side, "Welcome To My Heart" by Bob Brass and Irvin Levine. You would think that these great songs were tailor made for the spring/summer of `62 but, inexplicably, neither side scored in the US. All credit, I guess, to Craig Douglas for picking up on a good thing when he heard one. Any information on Gary Criss would be appreciated. I just hope he bumped into Jeff Lemlich at sometime during his career. Mike Edwards -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 15 Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 22:13:34 +0000 From: Phil Milstein > Subject: Re: The Shangri-Las "Past, Present And Future" Richard Williams wrote: > I'm enjoying the exchanges on "Past Present and Future", but > isn't the whole point about the appeal of such a song that it > refuses to tell us everything? Questions unanswered are for me, too, a key ingredient to my affection for certain popsongs. But I also wonder whether the lyricist him- or herself even knew the secrets. --Phil Milstein -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
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