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Spectropop - Digest Number 653

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______________        S  P  E  C  T  R  O  P  O  P        ______________
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                        Jamie LePage (1953-2002)

There are 24 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: Music and emotion
           From: Phil Milstein 
      2. Liking Bad Music (was Re: Knockin' the Hermits)
           From: Jeff Lemlich 
      3. Four Seasons Soundalikes
           From: Kingsley Abbott 
      4. Music & the emotions
           From: Kingsley Abbott 
      5. Re: Liking Bad Music
           From: Phil Chapman 
      6. Re: Aussie Carole King
           From: Norman 
      7. Re: Liking Bad Music
           From: Phil Milstein 
      8. Re: Johnny Cymbal
           From: Marc Miller 
      9. Standing in the Shadows of Motown (2002)
           From: Neb Rodgers 
     10. Re: Music & the emotions
           From: Phil Milstein 
     11. Joyce Webb
           From: Davie Gordon 
     12. Pandoras - Games
           From: Patrick Rands 
     13. Re: Music and emotion
           From: James Botticelli 
     14. Unspooled - The quaint cassette is sent reeling...
           From: Neb Rodgers 
     15. RE: Standing in the Shadows of Motown (2002)
           From: Chatbusters 
     16. Re: Pandoras - Games
           From: Phil Milstein 
     17. Re: Pandoras - Games
           From: Bob Wallis 
     18. Re: Liking Bad Music
           From: Mike C 
     19. Cryin'
           From: Bob Rashkow 
     20. Re: Tom Dowd RIP
           From: Shawn Baldwin 
     21. Re: Cryin'
           From: James Botticelli 
     22. Re: Liking Bad Music . . . the Shaggs
           From: Phil Milstein  So what I would like to explore is what music does to 
> our emotions, and how it achieves this effect.

Music alone among the arts is uniquely equipped to both 
depict and evoke the full range of human emotions. It is, 
in part, a case of an abstract medium meeting a similarly 
abstract area of the human makeup, conjoining these two 
vague entities most harmoniously. The same can be said, of 
course, for each of the fine arts, but by operating solely 
by controlling the vibrations of the surrounding air, music 
strikes the brain's emotional center at a most primal level. 
Even beyond that, its core components of melody, harmony and 
rhythm each in its own right has a similarly atavistic 

I've heard all sorts of arguments as to which of the arts is 
the most "perfect". Film, for instance, incorporates all of 
the art forms into one, but its usually quite literal visual 
representations serve ultimately to disengage the audience's 
imagination. Film (and, even moreso, its cousin television) 
is the best medium for propagandistically influencing a 
society, but that is wholly different -- in some ways, quite 
the opposite -- from evoking genuine emotions.

Book-length writing is, in a sense, the most stupid medium, 
being the only one that requires more than one sitting to 
complete. The so-called plastic arts, such as painting, 
sculpture and photography, certainly have their strengths, 
but by primarily addressing the eye they take a "front-door" 
approach to the mind, and with it sacrifice the deeper, more 
seductive possibilities allowed by our other senses.

Dance requires nothing but one human body to achieve its 
effects, but how often do the remnant images of a dance once 
seen creep into the mind and take hold? The strange effects 
of melody upon the memory are emblematic of music's deep, 
resonating powers. (Ever hear just a few notes of a tune, 
even played at an almost subliminally quiet level, and still 
recognize the song? This phenomenon often even takes place 
subconsciously, with the listener completing a barely-heard 
melody before being aware that a melody is even there. 
Americans of a certain age will remember the game show Name 
That Tune, where contestants would bid against one another 
to win a chance to identify a song in the least amount of 
notes. The bidding would often get down as low as three or 
four notes, and I once saw a lady recognize Java in just one 

Music alone resonates, both literally and figuratively, with 
a place deep within the human body and spirit. It's no 
accident that its played a vital role in every society that 
has ever been anthropologically documented. Some scholars, 
in fact, have even argued that music predates speech as 
man's earliest means of communication, and it wouldn't 
surprise me in the least if we ever discover that that's 

Song, which in essence adds poetry to music, can, as with 
film, sometimes detract from the abstractness of a piece, 
but (as again with film, granted) it can also address its 
audience on an altogether more direct level than music 
alone, thus presenting a whole other set of weaponry with 
which to attack our emotional borders.

There is no escape from the power of music. We fanatics have 
already recognized that, and caved in to it. Music will 
forever remain available for anyone else to come to when 
they're ready.

--Phil Milstein

-------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 2 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 05:02:23 -0000 From: Jeff Lemlich Subject: Liking Bad Music (was Re: Knockin' the Hermits) Phil Chapman wrote: > I share a slightly different viewpoint; that there is 'bad' music, > *and* you can still like it, rather like fast food is quite fun > sometimes, even though you know it's not much good for you. I completely agree. I'm completely captivated by Donna Lynn's Capitol label stinker "That's Me, I'm The Brother", which has no redeeming qualities outside of being, well, irresistably bad! And then there's "Into Outer Space With Lucia Pamela", a 65-year-old woman flipping, flopping, and flying on the moon, and singing off-key in a way that makes me want to take the needle off the record. Yet a little while later, I get the desire to play it again, because in its own twisted way, it's absolutely brilliant! That's me, I'm the brother... Jeff Lemlich -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 3 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 10:50:22 -0000 From: Kingsley Abbott Subject: Four Seasons Soundalikes Just got the Four Seasons Soundalikes CD from Bim Bam. It's marked as Vol 1, has 27 tracks, and is jolly good fun. 'Does exactly what it says on the tin' (Brit ad reference). Fave so far is "Big Town" by The Fraternity Brothers. Though it does, perhaps inevitably, show just how good the real Seasons records were.... One moan as ever - why can't bootleggers of such material have enough pride in achievement to give some basic info such as orig release details/dates/groupo info if known. If you're going to break a law, why not do it in style? Or does making the quick buck preclude such attention to detail...? Kingsley -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 4 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 10:40:49 -0000 From: Kingsley Abbott Subject: Music & the emotions Peter Lerner's interesting questions about how and why we like music has me reaching for another of my hats: It is really about how we filter our experiences of the world. All our input enters through our five senses, and once the info is in our brain we immediately go through a complicated system of deletion, distortion and generalisation using a mass of our filters (language, memories, decisions, values, beliefs, attitudes and meta-programs). The net result is that we make our own unique 'internal representation' of the experience. This can be further changed and distorted when we let it out again through our filters (esp language, which can at times be found lacking with our descriptions of emotional responses). Our brain cells (some 100 billion) use connections (count one per second and you would be counting for some 32m years - estimated figure you understand!). NEW connections are formed by new experiences, thus making our individual mind maps unique, and further make our responses different. Our emotional brain areas are found in a different of the brain to our cognitive areas. Plato well understood that the emotions worked differentely when he described them as the 'multi-headed monster' that impinged on rational thought and behaviour. Music is very powerful in that it has effects on our three main brain areas: our reptilian, survival brain ('I'm Hungry'), our Limbic ('I fancy A pizza') and our later developing thinking cap ('Where can I get a pizza?'). Music theory, now being used in education to effect learning situations, can have a basic soothing bodily effect (via heartbeat for example), can smooth or stimulate our emotions, and from that cause us to make new cortical links that we can later recall as responses to certain pieces of music. This is why certain fave pieces of music immediately evoke pictures (the visual ones amongst us), describable events (the more auditory ones), or movement (kinesthetic ones). We are all a mix of these, perhaps with one as a prefered form of learning. Music (as with the recent references to "Dancing Queen" being a sure fire wedding winner) often has similar memories for many folk that involve all three of these learning styles. Stress 'similar' here, as there can be no 'shared' memory as we all have unique internal filters and distortions. Peter's responses to certain pieces of music are thus uniquely his, and are still changing as his subsequent experiences in all the brain areas constantly modify his models. This explains how music that grabbed us strongly in youth evokes a lesser (or perhaps greater) reaction now. Peter's strong responses are rooted in his world model, which is able to be changed by him, rather than in any distinct outside world (which cannot be changed by him). We are all like this - we may shared similar responses, but each is uniquely ours. This whole area is fascinating, with much ongoing research, and I feel is likely to provide many new insights in the future. Hope this hasn't been too boring a response - who else can offer thoughts?? Can any of you producer/engineer types pick up any of these aspects from your work/experiences?? Kingsley Abbott PS None of the above explains why ANYONE likes..............(fill in own choice!) -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 5 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 12:01:39 -0000 From: Phil Chapman Subject: Re: Liking Bad Music Jeff Lemlich wrote: > ...............I'm completely captivated by Donna Lynn's > Capitol label stinker "That's Me, I'm The Brother", which > has no redeeming qualities outside of being, well, > irresistibly bad! And then there's "Into Outer Space With > Lucia Pamela"........... I've always had a personal chart of these things, now rapidly evolving thanks to many S'pop members' lateral look at life! A classic for me is the Singing Bodies' (male) destruction of the beautiful "What Am I Gonna Do With You (Hey Baby)". Any chance of playing your two to musica, Jeff, for a bit of light relief? Phil -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 6 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 22:54:24 +1030 From: Norman Subject: Re: Aussie Carole King Having grown up listening to and watching the Executives in their various line-ups I certainly wouldn't compare them to the Mamas and the Papas. Fifth Dimension on a bad day, maybe. The executives as we got to see and hear them were definately MOR. In 1967 they managed to get a couple of hits in the charts but certainly not top twenty. They were highly regarded musically here in Australia, more particularly in Sydney and Melbourne. They were most certainly made by their TV appearances on the one or two National pop programmes which existed at the time. Apart from the fact that their singer was named Carole King there only other claim to fame would be one time member Ray Burton. He co-wrote "I Am Woman" with Helen Reddy. Norman (who can't quite get used to being referred to as antipodean) -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 7 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 10:56:31 +0000 From: Phil Milstein Subject: Re: Liking Bad Music Hi Phil, > I've always had a personal chart of these things, now rapidly > evolving thanks to many S'pop members' lateral look at life! > A classic for me is the Singing Bodies' (male) destruction of > the beautiful "What Am I Gonna Do With You (Hey Baby)". > Any chance of playing your two to musica, Jeff, for a bit of > light relief? Ever heard The Shaggs? There were several '60s groups by that name (or similar ones) in the U.S., the one I mean was a trio (and occasionally quartet) of sisters from New Hampshire, whose recordings sounded as if the girls could only hear one another from down a series of hallways. For fans of "left field" music, their debut album, Philosophy Of The World, is the Rosetta Stone. The hope of locating an original copy, on Third World Records, is one of the main reasons I moved to Boston in 1980, but that's another long story in itself. If curious, I'll be happy to run you off a dub. It's a polarizing record, there's 0% chance of running lukewarm on it. However, as Jeff experienced with Lucia Pamela, an initially cold reaction might turn very, very hot with a little patience. --Phil M. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 8 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 11:05:29 -0500 From: Marc Miller Subject: Re: Johnny Cymbal >Was he Derek (of Cinnamon fame)? Mike, re Johnny Cymbal: > Indeed he was. Though his brother went on the road as Derek. > He did that stuff with George Tobin I think. It was on Bang, no? Yes. Marc -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 9 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 08:16:09 -0800 (PST) From: Neb Rodgers Subject: Standing in the Shadows of Motown (2002) Looks like this movie will be in the theatres on Nov 15. I can't wait to see it! -Neb -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 10 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 11:54:20 +0000 From: Phil Milstein Subject: Re: Music & the emotions Kingsley Abbott wrote: > PS None of the above explains why ANYONE likes.......... > (fill in own choice!) Or doesn't like ... Dusty Springfield! --Phil M. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 11 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 17:39:21 -0000 From: Davie Gordon Subject: Joyce Webb This is a question for Mike Rashkow. I've been researching the career of Joyce Webb and noticed that she recorded "I Don't Wanna Be Left Outside" (Greenwich - Rashkow) for Columbia ( 44845, 1969) Did you have anything to do with the recording, Mike? Production is credited to "Dean Christopher for LK Productions" Do you remember anything about her? She had a varied career starting out in Texas on the Domino label which issued the original version of "You Cheated". She seems to have moved to New York in the early sixties. She had around ten singles including releases on Golden World, Columbia and Warner Bros. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 12 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 19:40:05 -0000 From: Patrick Rands Subject: Pandoras - Games I updated the song of the week section of my website with an mp3 sound file of the ultra sweet and obscure 45 Games by the all female band the Pandoras who played in New England from 1964 to 1968. Enjoy! Does anyone know how many Pandoras recordings are available on cd? I'm trying to find the flipside to About My Baby (I Could Write a Book) - it's called New Day. If anyone can point me to a copy or can make a sound file to play that would be fantastic. :Patrick -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 13 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 14:41:49 -0500 From: James Botticelli Subject: Re: Music and emotion Peter Lerner: > So what I would like to explore is what music does to > our emotions, and how it achieves this effect. Phil Milstein: > Music alone among the arts is uniquely equipped to both > depict and evoke the full range of human emotions. Frank Zappa once said "Music is my religion. Its the only one I can find that delivers the goods." -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 14 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 12:09:38 -0800 (PST) From: Neb Rodgers Subject: Unspooled - The quaint cassette is sent reeling... From the Washington Post, a fond farewell to cassettes. In the Digital Age, The Quaint Cassette Is Sent Reeling Into History's Dustbin -Neb -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 15 Date: Sat, 01 Nov 1997 20:14:25 -0000 From: Chatbusters Subject: RE: Standing in the Shadows of Motown (2002) Hi Neb, UK PREMIERE of the film "Standing In The Shadows Of Motown", about James Jamerson and the Funk Brothers, is at the Odeon Cinema West End 2, Leicester Square, London - 03 .30pm Friday 15th November 2002. It is also being shown at Odeon Cinema West End 1, Leicester Square, London - 6pm on Saturday 16th November 2002. You can order tickets by telephoning the National Film Institute on 0207 928 3232. THIS COULD BE THE ONLY TIME THIS FILM IS SHOWN ON THE BIG SCREEN IN THE UK!!!! DON'T MISS IT!! Tickets are 9 Adults, 5 Standby Concessions on the day. Credit card bookings 50p extra per booking, tickets posted 50p extra. No booking fee for debit cards. THIS IS A MUST SEE FILM. Have you read the interview with Annie Jamerson (wife of the late, great James Jamerson and mother of James Jnr) in Issue 21 of Chatbusters? Best wishes and hope to see all you UK Motown fans there, Rik Chatbusters, the only monthly Motown magazine in the world! -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 16 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 15:38:42 +0000 From: Phil Milstein Subject: Re: Pandoras - Games Patrick Rands wrote: > Does anyone know how many Pandoras recordings are available > on cd? There's a great Pandoras page at --PhilM. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 17 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 21:37:22 -0000 From: Bob Wallis Subject: Re: Pandoras - Games Patrick, I have an MP3 copy of New Day I can send your way. Written by Teddy Dewart of another Boston band, Teddy and the Pandas, and Tom McEwan, the Pandas' road manager, the song has a folk-rock sound and is very similar to Suzanna Hoffs and the Bangles. The Pandas and the Pandoras frequently worked together because of the novel similarity in names, though they were not connected otherwise. The Bob Stone penned Games was also recorded, but not released, by Teddy and the Pandas with Toni Wine, who's been mentioned a lot here lately, singing back-up. BW -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 18 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 22:20:24 -0000 From: Mike C Subject: Re: Liking Bad Music Phil Milstein wrote: > Ever heard The Shaggs? Mike C. writes: Oh Yes! I own the second album, "Shaggs Own Thing". I have never forgotten The Wiggins' song entitled "My Pal Foot Foot". I can hum the melody for you right now, it's forever entrenched. But it is as if these sisters were all playing something different; in different time signatures and keys, all for the collective, beautiful whole. And their choice of covers...."Paper Roses" and "Yesterday Once More". Brilliant! I'm just sorry they never covered Goffin and King. What The Shaggs could have done with "Her Royal Majesty" or "Let's Turkey Trot". The Shaggs rank right up there with Mrs. Miller. : ) I do believe these albums have been re-released onto CD. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 19 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 17:40:26 -0500 From: Bob Rashkow Subject: Cryin' Country Paul has me LOL with the Turtles et al. I had that 45 as a kid and I laughed then, playing that typically insane Turtles B side. "Each and every day, eatin' all that hay, Moo, baby..." They did a few demented numbers in this vein in '68 and '69 as B-sides. ...Music that makes me cry. Oh, God, don't get me started. Why does Bobby Goldsboro's "I'm A Drifter" bring tears to my eyes every time I hear it? Or, for that matter, Peter, Paul & Mary's "The Song Is Love"?? "That's What Friends Are For", possibly the 8Ts anthem to end all anthems?? Etc. etc. I think Richard Tearle, Kingsley, and Phil Milstein has each very eloquently expressed at least a few of the reasons for this. I for one would love to hear more on this subject! A few very brief notes! Louise Posnick is always a treat to hear from - let's just say although I was quite young at the time of the "invasion" looking back now I believe it, although it would appear the efforts to rid the AM of black-oriented music (thank God!!!!) were unsuccessful to say the least. Labels out of Detroit such as Ric-Tic, Hot Wax and Invictus, Memphis' Chimneyville, etc. (I'm hypothesizing) never would get ANY AM exposure if it hadn't been for Motown and Stax. Also: "The Bears" - GREAT record, wish I had it, suspect other bands besides the Royal Guardsmen covered it too--didn't know the Teardrops hailed from Cincinnati, am about to check the Spectropop website for more info if any, especially Who was Paul Trefzger (guy who wrote both sides of Musicor "Tears Come Tumbling"/"You Won't Be There")? Bobster -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 20 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 17:38:32 -0600 From: Shawn Baldwin Subject: Re: Tom Dowd RIP Tom Dowd was a true friend to Soul Music and he will be truly missed. I really agreed with him when he said he thought Cissy Houston should be called the Queen Mother Of Soul. Shawn -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 21 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 19:40:39 -0500 From: James Botticelli Subject: Re: Cryin' Bob Rashkow wrote: > Why does Bobby Goldsboro's "I'm A Drifter" > bring tears to my eyes every time I hear it? Clarification? Is this "The Drifter" as recorded by my heroes The Match? -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 22 Date: Fri, 01 Nov 2002 23:59:04 +0000 From: Phil Milstein And their choice of covers...."Paper Roses" and "Yesterday Once > More". Brilliant! I'm just sorry they never covered Goffin and > King. I can tell you right now where they would stand on the recent Herman's Hermits debate: most emphatically PRO. H.H. was The Shaggs' self-professed favorite group and biggest influence. Their name, by the way, was in reference not to a hairstyle but to the Disney movie The Shaggy Dog. --Phil M. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 23 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 02:32:56 -0500 From: Country Paul Subject: Re: Zill, DC5, etc Philip Vaughn - gee, a Pat Zill website? Amazing. On it, there's a claim that "Pick Me Up On Your Way Down" sold 1,000,000 copies. Wasn't it on Indigo? I didn't know the label was big enough to carry it off! Is the album with that song on it the original hit? an original album from the period? or a re-recording in total or in part? Phil Chapman: > O. B. Massengill's arrangements were lightly swinging... There's also a George Massengill who's a producer, and worked with Linda Ronstadt on "Warm Your Heart." Don't know if they're related. The Google search is tough; for our overseas friends, in the US, Massengill is also a brand name for a feminine hygiene product, and the OB initials in the search result in a large number of gynecological returns! Phil Milstein's notorious B-sides call-out brings to mind the previously -noted A-sides played in reverse by Yellow Balloon and Napoleon XIV. Spector's instrumental B-sides were notorious filler - not even particulaly listenable. A special nod to Tipsy Dave for mentioning Rosie & The Originals' "Give Me Love." As I believe I mentioned here earlier, that was the record John Lennon was playing when Rolling Stone Magazine arrived to do its first interview with him. It's at the top of my nominal "All-time Worst Records In The World" list. Her website has the background. A wonderful listening experience. Steve Harvey notes: > The sax solo on the Jones Girl on the back of In the Still of the Night > never changes. Same note through out the entire solo. Same was true with a lot of Jimmy Wright sax solos on early Gee tracks by Frankie Lymon & the Teenagers, The Cleftones, etc. But Jimmy Wright rocked! Xavier wrote: > The Dave Clark Five had very few redeeming qualities.... I beg to differ. I've seen a lot lamer acts celebrated here. Like Herman's Hermits (woulda liked to hear the Five do "My Reservation's Been Confirmed" - now THAT would have rreally rocked!). Remember how fresh "Glad All Over" was when you first heard it when new. "Can't You See That She's Mine" rivalled "I Saw Her Standing There" - it's still my favorite DCV track. "Because" is really quite beautiful. OK, they had their 15 minutes of fame despite being hyped as "the next Beatles," and the drummer couldn't roll around the set even if he had wheels, but I thought their 15 minutes worked very well. And Eric Charge, I think you're way off base calling Ms. Faithfull "the least talented singer in Britain." I find her early "Plaisir D'Amour" to be still extremely beautiful and her later "Ballad of Lucy Brown" chilling and brilliant. Two remarkable sides (pun intended) from an artist who by all logic shouldn't still be alive. On the other hand, she's done her share of clinkers along the way, and I wouldn't want to trade lives with her. Patrick Rands, thank you very much for the English version of the Bert Kaempfert site, It sure reads easier than the Automatic Translator! I posted a request for Cindy Ellis info - hope it leads somewhere. I'll pass it along here for those interested. Eddy, thanks for Gregmark #1. And Mike, many thanks to the lead to the discographies. Wow - Gregmark had records by Duane Eddy, Billy Storm (Valiants, Africa, Alley Cats, etc.) and Donnie Owens (the gorgeous "Need You" on Guyden) - and the "obvious" Paris Sisters. And Owens and the great Sanford Clark were on Trey, too. Any of these tracks reissued anywhere? Just when you think you know everything there is to know, a whole new universe opens up.... More soon, Country Paul -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 24 Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 02:52:56 -0500 From: John Rausch Subject: K TELL... Do Tell Someone mentioned their K TELL web site, sorry I forgot , but it did make me remember my first, and only K TELL TV purchase. Mid 70`s called I Believe In Music. Lots of memories attached to that LP. J. Rausch -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------

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