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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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There are 25 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1. Re: You Didn't Have To Be So Nice / Breathless Shivers
From: Billy G Spradlin
2. Re: "Concrete and Clay" commercial
From: Clark Besch
3. Re: Styrene vs plastic 45s
From: Billy G Spradlin
4. Re: Ben Findon
From: Andy
5. Re: Dick Clark/Monkees
From: Austin Roberts
6. Ed Rambeau / lyrics to instrumentals
From: Mark Hill
7. RIP Randy Van Warmer; Al Kooper questions; Soul Brothers; Ji...
From: Austin Roberts
8. Re: Jeff Lynne/ELO
From: Mike McKay
9. Re: Some Things Just Stick In Your Mind / Del Shannon / more music on TV
From: Phil Milstein
10. Re: Ben Findon
From: ACJ
11. Re: Randy Van Warmer
From: Clark Besch
12. belated welcome to Eddie Rambeau
From: Artie Wayne
13. Bubblegum
From: Mark T
14. Norma Nyro ? ! :-)
From: Ed Rambeau
15. Re: Elvis Sun Records master tapes
From: steveo
16. Re: Heaven Bound with Tony Scotti
From: Ed Salamon
17. Re: Rag Dolls
From: Clark Besch
18. Re: Ben Findon
From: Mark T
19. Re: Digest Number 1278
From: Al Kooper
20. Blues Project / Tommy Flanders
From: Al Kooper
21. Brian Wilson on Dylan
From: Al Kooper
22. "This Diamond Ring"
From: Al Kooper
23. Chat with Al Kooper
From: Artie Butler
24. Re: Obscurities Online?
From: Al Kooper
25. Re: 40 years of Navy Blue
From: Austin Roberts
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Message: 1
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 05:13:33 -0000
From: Billy G Spradlin
Subject: Re: You Didn't Have To Be So Nice / Breathless Shivers
> On the Beach Boys box set there is a separate disc with cool
> special stuff on it. There is a "vocals separated from the
> music" version of "Wouldn't It Be Nice." If you just listen
> to the vocals side (right channel) when the background harmony
> parts come in at:
> "Maybe if, we think and wish and hope and pray, it might
> come true... BG: Run Run Ree-ooooooo..."Good lord. You don't
> have to ask what angels sound like now.
One of my favorite things to do whenever I hear the stereo mix
of "Don't Worry Baby" on a oldies station is to use the balance
control on the car stereo and isolate the channel the Beach Boys
backing vocals are on. I dont sing Brian's part, just enjoy the
greatest OOOOH'ers in rock history.
Billy
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Message: 2
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 05:38:56 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Re: "Concrete and Clay" commercial
Mark wrote:
> I haven't seen it, so could you kindly tell me which commercial uses
> "Concrete and Clay"?
Ed Rambeau wrote:
> It was for FTD Flowers, Mark.
Funny part is they don't use the title line anywhere in it, because
it doesn't fit the idea. They use the into line and instrumental
music mainly.
Clark
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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 05:55:21 -0000
From: Billy G Spradlin
Subject: Re: Styrene vs plastic 45s
Previously:
> You may already know this or you may not. Many record companies
> used BOTH vinyl and styrene, and for these labels, instead of
> tapping on the record, you can tell one from the other by just
> looking at the label. In such cases as Gordy, Cameo, and Uni,
> if the label's colors are deep, flat or dark, they are vinyl
> records. Bright or "bleached" colored labels are styrene pressings.
Styrene labels are cheaply pasted on and you can see the edge of the
label, making them easy to tear off by a jukebox or record changer.
Sometimes they can fall off if they get wet. Labels for vinyl records
are molded into the plastic.
Independent record companies used plants all over the country and if
they could find one that would press their 45's for the cheapest
price, thats what they went with. Most of the Motown Vinyl 45's were
done in Nashville and they usually go for a higher price with
collectors.
> On that topic, Herb Alpert's first TJ Brass album was pressed on
> vinyl only, at his request, as styrene before 1962 was used on mono
> pressings of albums and vinyl on stereo. (According to this article)
> Herb wanted to make sure the pressings were top notch.
Thats interesting, most of the mono LP's I have from the early 60's
were always on Vinyl. Shame A&M didnt go all Vinyl for singles when
the label took off by the mid 60's.
The only styrene LP's I have ever seen were done by a budget label
called Halo, and Liberty's Sunset budget label. My Gary
Lewis "Listen" album is pressed this way. (The copy I bought from e-
bay had never been opened. The record didnt have a sleeve, those
cheap jerks!)
The cheapest vinyl I have ever seen is from Cameo/Parkway's Wyncote
budget label. They used the worst crap!
Billy
60's Jangle Radio!
http://listen.to/jangleradio
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Message: 4
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 05:23:28 -0000
From: Andy
Subject: Re: Ben Findon
Mark Frumento wrote:
> Does anyone have information on song writer Ben Findon? Over time
> I've accumulated records bearing his name in the writing credits.
> Most of what I have are well written harmony-based songs. Many of
> those songs are by obscure UK bands but he did write (with Peter
> Shelley) the wonderful "Impressions of Linda" for The Magic
Lanterns.
> I've searched the web and there is scattered information but it's
> hard to piece together.
If this is the same Ben Findon, i found about 3 songs done by Billy
Ocean...the best "Love Really Hurts Without You" (also done by the
Bellamy Bros.), "Light Up the World with Sunshine" by H JF & R and
"You Bring Out the Best in Me" by Jigsaw. anybody else?
andy
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Message: 5
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 00:06:33 EST
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: Dick Clark/Monkees
The Partridge Family situation was interesting,to say the least. Wes Farrell
was the producer and Screen Gems\Colgems were the publishers. I, for once, was
in the right place at the right time, since I was signed to Col-Gems as a staff
writer and in the process of signing with Wes's label, Chelsea,at the
time. Consequently, John Hill and I got a cut called Maybe Someday on their
Notebook album (no CD's then), but John had to give his publishing to Screen Gems.
Tight knit situation.
Austin Roberts
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Message: 6
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 23:50:01 -0500
From: Mark Hill
Subject: Ed Rambeau / lyrics to instrumentals
Hi Ed,
Can't thank you enough for the copies of your "Skin Diver" and
"Summertime Guy" tunes. Don't know where I'd have ever found
them otherwise.
It was SO COOL to hear the song I know as the theme from "The
Newlywed Game" only with lyrics! Another "version" to add to
the list.
As I uncover, research and learn more about pop music, I'm
finding more vocal versions of big instrumental hits that I
never knew. I'd be willing to bet that every one of those
instrumentals has eventually or originally had a lyrics version.
For instance, Andy Williams' vocal version of "Music To Watch
Girls By". Though it was a #34 hit in the US in 1967, I somehow
missed it until now. It's a good version, too, with a very groovy
60s sound. I understand it became a recent hit again in England
after it was used in a commercial there.
I wonder if there's a vocal version of WIPEOUT!
Dr. Mark
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/popmusicpopculture
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Message: 7
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 00:29:25 EST
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: RIP Randy Van Warmer; Al Kooper questions; Soul Brothers; Ji...
Previously:
> This group name doesn't appear on your website, Al, so could you please
> confirm or deny that you were in the Royal Teens ("Short Shorts," "Big Name
> Button")? People may joke about the songs -- true period pieces, to be sure
> but the tracks to both had the best down-and-dirty beats! If you were
> involved with them, do you know who did the sax parts? (And if Al can't
> answer that question, can anyone, please?)
I was told that Buddy Randall (Crandel) who was in the group and later the
Knickerbockers, played the sax on those songs. Now Al, I know I was wrong about
Leon Russel on This Diamond Ring, so if I'm wrong again,let me know. You can
find out so much stuff from a lot of the people involved in the records brought up.
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Message: 8
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 23:58:42 EST
From: Mike McKay
Subject: Re: Jeff Lynne/ELO
Country Paul wrote:
> My 2 cents on the ELO debate: I saw them live early on. Excellent. The
> great songs were great, the trite songs were trite, the hits got burned out
> quickly to my ears, but stayed around too long, obscuring some of the really
> good stuff that didn't make Top 40 radio. (Actually, that happened to a lot
> of groups. ....)
Paul, I'm glad someone has had the courage to tell the other side. With the
Lynne lovefest going on, I held my tongue, but you've inspired me to come
clean.
For the record, I like The Idle Race. I LOVE The Move, and Lynne-era Move in
particular ("Do Ya" was one of the greatest records of the 70s, and "Message
from the Country" is wonderful).
I think "Can't Get It Out of My Head" is a great song...and after that, I'm
hard-pressed to think of an ELO song that really knocks me out (and Lynne
should have been drawn and quartered for their awful remake of "Do Ya").
Their work could be sonically interesting on occasion,
but for me the songs just weren't there -- and I agree with you that they
lingered way past their shelf date.
Also sorry to say, I don't find him to be a very inspiring vocalist. I
appreciate all of his many contributions to "The Concert for George,"
but I wish they had picked someone else to sing "The Inner Light." I was
knocked out by the authentic live backing for it, but Lynne's vocal was
pretty ordinary.
Also for the record, I think the whole subject of Jeff Lynne started here
when I mentioned that there were some objections to his drum sound on
"Free as a Bird." It didn't ruin the record for me by any means...but
at the same time, why would you feel the need to impose YOUR drum sound
on top of someone who already has possibly the most recognizable drum
sound in the world?
Mike
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Message: 9
Date: Tue, 20 Jan 2004 22:40:19 -0500
From: Phil Milstein
Subject: Re: Some Things Just Stick In Your Mind / Del Shannon / more music on TV
Scott Swanson wrote:
> Jagger and Richards recorded a demo version of the song c. July 1964
> with the Andrew Oldham Orchestra backing them. (This is the version
> which can be found on the Stones' "Metamorphosis" LP). Supposedly,
> the same backing track was later used for Vashti's version, which was
> released in May 1965.
Thanks, Scott (and Mike McKay), that answers my questions real well.
However I don't know what version of Metamorphosis you're referring to,
as it's not on my original-release LP. Perhaps the CD reissue?
> Dick & Deedee's version was recorded c. December 1964, and Dick St. John
> has claimed that the Stones actually played on it. But I've never A/B'd
> all three songs to compare them.
Life is too short for A/B'ing unless you REALLY need to, yet I wonder if
they didn't just use the same tracks as Vashti, rather than have the
same group re-record it.
Scott again, re: Del Shannon's Oldham sessions:
> Life Is But Nothing (writers: Skinner/Rose)
This is amazing number, which Del nails beautifully (and, in light of
later events, most tragically). I wonder, though, if the "Rose" isn't
Fred Rose and the song of older, C&W origin.
David Coyle wrote:
> Crabby Appleton performing "Go Back" is the highlight
> of the otherwise unwatchable "Something Else" hosted
> by John Byner, and also featuring the Ides Of March
> (okay), that kid from "H.R. Pufnstuf," and a bunch of
> hula and bikini girls who seem way to interested in
> Byner. I still can't believe that Crabby Appleton has
> connections with the Millenium and the whole Curt
> Boettcher camp...
FYI, Something Else was a regular (albeit short-lived) series, so that
episode was just one of several, some of which were pretty enjoyable.
--Phil M.
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Message: 10
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 00:20:50 -0500 (EST)
From: ACJ
Subject: Re: Ben Findon
Mark Frumento: In 1975, Ben Findon co-wrote and produced "Love Really
Hurts Without You," the first U.S. Top 40 hit for Billy Ocean (and
Billy's only U.S. hit for eight or nine years, before "Caribbean Queen"
- but that's another discussion group).
ACJ
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Message: 11
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 15:07:17 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Re: Randy Van Warmer
Country Paul wrote:
> On a later album (whose title escapes me for the moment) he did
> a great song called "Whatever You Decide" -- uptempo, ringing
> guitars, superb layered vocals.
Mike McKay:
> I know nothing of Randy beyond his Top 40 hit and this song, which
> a powerpop friend of mine picked up on many years ago and turned
> me on to. I agree, it's a great one. Always cool when you make a
> "connection" like this with another listener who hears what you do,
> Paul!
A song I'd been trying to think of by Randy was his later 45, "Suzy".
Quite a different sounding vocal for him on it. No ballad here!
Pretty cool record if you find it. Also on Bearsville. Clark
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Message: 12
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 07:03:00 -0800 (PST)
From: Artie Wayne
Subject: belated welcome to Eddie Rambeau
Eddie........How ya' doin'? I apologize for not welcoming you sooner
.......but something was holding me back!! I realized what it was
yesterday, when Clark Blesch posted that your Diane Renay record
"Navy Blue" knocked my Joey Powers "Midnight Mary" out of the top ten
40 years ago...........I must've harbored some deep resentment.
Even though you don't know me.........I want you to know I've almost
forgiven you!! Seriously, I've enjoyed your posts and have checked out
your website. I was especially impressed with your "other-worldly"
paintings.
regards, Artie Wayne
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Message: 13
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 16:17:12 -0000
From: Mark T
Subject: Bubblegum
There have been a few of the other bubblegum greats performing
around the country in the last few years: Ron Dante, Andy Kim,
Bo Donaldson, Tony Burrows, Tommy Roe. What about you Austin?
Do you still perform at all? It would be great to see you on one
of these BG package tours.
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Message: 14
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:31:08 EST
From: Ed Rambeau
Subject: Norma Nyro ? ! :-)
Sorry about the erroneous message. I'm The Sky was written by Norma
Tanega. It's been so many years and I get the 2 confused sometimes.
Ed Rambeau
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Message: 15
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 07:16:56 -0800 (PST)
From: steveo
Subject: Re: Elvis Sun Records master tapes
Mike on the cutting up of Elvis Sun mastertape:
> To me, this sounds like messing with a very significant piece of
> rock 'n' roll history for the sake of making a few bucks. What
> say you?
Mike, I have thot about it for awhile...I'm not opposed to this...
probbly the tape is decomposing...and what the hell...Why not...
That's my take on it. Steveo
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Message: 16
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 15:43:55 -0000
From: Ed Salamon
Subject: Re: Heaven Bound with Tony Scotti
Previously:
> Don't know anything about this Tony Scotti guy but I know Michael
> Lloyd, who was a sunshine pop genius, produced them.
Thank you for making me think of Tony Scotti, who I haven't had the
opportunity yo speak to in the last 20 years. I met Tony through
Mike Curb, for whom by then Tony was doing radio promotion. As I
recall we had dinner with Mike's family in Pittsburgh when I was at
KDKA in the early 70s. During the late 70's, when I was at 10-Q in
Los Angeles, I saw Tony and his brother Ben a lot when they had an
independent promo company, Scotti Brothers. They started a label and
had major hits like Survivor's "Eye Of The Tiger", James Brown's
"Only In America" and a lot of movie related hits. Now when I read
about Tony, he and Ben are Producers or Executive Producers of
Movies. Ann Marshall was the girl who sang lead so well in
Heavenbound. She was also an actress.
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Message: 17
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 15:32:15 -0000
From: Clark Besch
Subject: Re: Rag Dolls
Doowopdaddy wrote:
> I am looking for any CD's that would contain songs by two of my
> favorite "girl-group sound" performers, The Rag Dolls and
> Bernadette Carroll. Any suggestions?
I only know of 2 Mala 45s by the Rag Dolls, I think. However, what
would really be cool is if they'd get on Cd something they did for
WSAI radio DJ Dusty Rhodes in 65. Not sure if they were from Cincy,
but they did a rendition where they sang "Dusty, Dusty Rhodes..." for
Dusty's radio show, like artists tended to do in the 80's for radio
stations. I know Dusty has a copy, because he played it on his show
a few years ago. Great Dj and good friend. Currently back on the
revamped WSAI AM playing oldies, so he's gone full circle, I guess!
Clark
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Message: 18
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 16:13:56 -0000
From: Mark T
Subject: Re: Ben Findon
One of my favorite songs that he wrote is called Never and Everyday
Thing. I have several versions of it: Granny's Intentions, Eli
Bonaparte, Wayne Fontana, Springfield Park and what I think is the
best by Craig Scott, a New Zealand pop star. Not to familiar with his
other work but if its anything like this song I'd love to get a list
of what else he did.
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Message: 19
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:59:19 EST
From: Al Kooper
Subject: Re: Digest Number 1278
In a message dated 1/21/04 1:09:57 AM, spectropop@yahoogroups.com writes:
> Message: 25
> Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 03:10:03 -0000
> From: Mark Frumento
> Subject: Al Kooper's website
>
> Al -- I visited your website and it's wonderful. I was especially
> taken by the photo of you with David Crosby. Wonderful shot.
>
> The site is well worth a visit ... there is a lot to look at!
>
Thanks so much
I dont think it hurts that my webmaster is Elliott Randall, he of the Reelin
In The Years Steely Dan daze. We are constantly tinkering with it.
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Message: 20
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:54:45 EST
From: Al Kooper
Subject: Blues Project / Tommy Flanders
> One of my very favorite Blues Project songs is Eric Anderson's
> "Violets of Dawn" with lead vocals by Tommy Flanders. Tommy was
> originally billed as the BP's lead singer, right Al?
That is correct. He appeared to be from Boston and he had the
leadsinger thang goin on. He did splits and gave Jagger a run for
his money as far as we were concerned.
FYI in 1994 we recut Violets of Dawn on my out-of-print live album
Soul Of A Man. It has great first time background vocals and you may
like it if you like that song. If I ever get musica instruction, I'll
post it.
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Message: 21
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:56:42 EST
From: Al Kooper
Subject: Brian Wilson on Dylan
> Speaking of which, I also recall reading that you were praising
> Pet Sounds to anyone who would listen at the 1966 Newport Folk
> Festival. Did that include Bob Dylan? I have always wondered what
> he thought about Brian Wilson's mid '60s output. The only time I
> have read anything about his opinion is a late '80s interview in
> Rolling Stone, where he says something to the effect that: The
> Beach Boys were doing things that had not been done before and I
> know I (meaning Mr. D) was doing things that had not been done
> before.
I never chatted Brian Wilson to Dylan. It just never has come up in
any conversation we've had.
AK
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Message: 22
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 11:31:28 EST
From: Al Kooper
Subject: "This Diamond Ring"
Austin Roberts:
> Calm down Al. I'm old. At least I remembered (Leon Russell) had
> something to do with ("This Diamond Ring"). How about an E for effort?
E-e-e-e-e-e-e !!!!!!!
AK
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Message: 23
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 03:13:33 EST
From: Artie Butler
Subject: Chat with Al Kooper
I just wanted to let everyone know that I just had the most delightful
conversation on the phone with Al Kooper. We both come from New York and got
started in the business around the same time. We had a chance to talk about the
record business back then, and what a joy it was just to be a part of it. We
shared some tales about people we both knew, and caught up a little after
thirty-six years of not crossing each others path. Let me tell anyone that
reads this, he is the real deal. Although we have not been in the same studio
or room for all this time, it was very refreshing to talk to a guy like myself
who has done it all, and still has the passion for music like I do. He told me
I arranged a record for him way back then. I can't wait to go buy it and
reminisce. This was a delightful experience for me. I hope for Al as well.
Artie Butler
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Message: 24
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 02:56:30 EST
From: Al Kooper
Subject: Re: Obscurities Online?
Rex Strother wrote:
> Just a question to the many fans of this site - has anyone tried out
> iTunes, or its competitors? I was wondering if all this hype about
> "500,000 tracks" being available for purchase, if any music of the
> type discussed here was popping up for legitimate download (which,
> of course, would never satisfy the vinyl fetish of Mick Patrick - but
> would be making this stuff available to the "masses").
Joe Nelson wrote:
> Fat chance. The process of taking older music from analog to digital
> doesn't change between CD and MP3 - you still have to pull the tape,
> bake it, EQ it and transfer it in real time to be remastered
> digitally. I doubt anyone will be pulling tapes to satisfy a few
> listeners with interest. The 500,000 tracks are as common as most
> CD'sd because it's easier to just pop in the CD and rip it.
ITunes, the software on Mac at least, has a lot of problems. First off
you have to create on the software first what is gonna go on the iPoditself.
The software(iTunes) has options for uniform crossfades between
songs that work & sound great, but actually DON'T get transferred to the
iPod. This infuriatesme. Then there are other bugs in the software that
have caused me hours of re-dos. However, I personally feel challenged to
beat all software bugs, and between good sense and shareware I've done
pretty well with iTunes. I have tried to penetrate Apple at various trade
shows to no avail. Do the actual programmers know of all these bugs?
One will never know, it seems.
However, all things considered....I'm on the road a great deal. My
favorite 2700 tunes are packed securely in my cigarette pack-sized Pod.
I carry a pair of powered Bose speakers and I've got the best-sounding
hotelroom wherever I go. That has become life-changing to me who used
to carry around those looseleaf books full of CDs with many tracks I didnt
really care about. This is truly the Walkman of the new century.
The Itunes Music Store is okay with me. It helps me find new music that is
tolerable. You can audition a pre-programmed 30 seconds of each of the
500,000 tracks with a quick click. If an entire CD is 10.99 on there and you
only like 7 tracks, ya just d/l those 7 tracks and you have the album YOU
want for $7 instead of $11. That's a groove. Also investigating names
I've seen but not heard is helpful. I found a whole album by Guster I loved
that I would never have heard in the real world. A great pop record BTW.
So Al says get that iPod and improve your life.
Hint: There are four generations of Pods. The second & fourth are the best.
They dont have those four way-2-sensitive-buttons in front that cannot be
controlled. Much easier to work without them. The 4th gen are the brand
new "mini" pods which hold a thousand songs and cost less than most and have no
four buttons on them. Come in 5 colors also. If you can, avoid the third
generation common ipods. I think they suck///
Al Kooper
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Message: 25
Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2004 02:33:13 EST
From: Austin Roberts
Subject: Re: 40 years of Navy Blue
Hey Eddie,
Welcome aboard this incredible site.
Just so you know, your version of Concrete And Clay was huge
in the Newport News, Virginia Beach and Norfolk areas of
Virginia where I grew up. I never even heard the other version.
Best,
Austin Roberts
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SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!
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