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Spectropop - Digest Number 1221

               SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: Poor quality pressings
           From: Billy G. Spradlin 
      2. Dennis Wilson LP title
           From: Poul Nielsen 
      3. Re: Grass Roots
           From: Glenn 
      4. Bobby Vee "Beautiful People"
           From: Bob Celli 
      5. Re. William Shatner
           From: Guy Lawrence 
      6. Re: Bi question
           From: Glenn 
      7. Re: Medicine Man / Buchanan bros
           From: Austin Roberts 
      8. Re: Speaking of the Knickerbockers and the Righteous Bros...
           From: Austin Roberts 
      9. Re: Lambert-Potter productions / Magpie Stump?? / Arkade
           From: Austin Roberts 
     10. Re: The Buchanan Bros / Medicine Man
           From: Austin Roberts 
     11. Re: The Transformed Shatner
           From: Roger Smith 
     12. Jack Nitzsche at Spectropop update.
           From: Martin Roberts 
     13. Alien Encounters
           From: Chris 
     14. Re: William Shatner
           From: Rodney Rawlings 
     15. Pre-Band, wherefore Superman?; stereo Smash (and Merc and Philips); running a'Fowley
           From: Country Paul 
     16. Re: Adam & Eve
           From: Austin Roberts 
     17. Words & Melodies, Melodies & Words
           From: Chris 
     18. Re: Answer Songs
           From: Fred Clemens 
     19. Re: Speaking Of Apple Records...
           From: Mark Frumento 
     20. Re: Answer Songs
           From: Steve Harvey 
     21. Re: Badfinger and a pino colada, my friend
           From: Mark Frumento 
     22. How Sweet It Is
           From: Bob Rashkow 
     23. Re: Happy Christmas was a race horse
           From: Steve Harvey 
     24. Left Banke's '70s LP
           From: Mark 
     25. Goodbye My Love
           From: Michael Edwards 

Message: 1 Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2004 00:31:18 -0000 From: Billy G. Spradlin Subject: Re: Poor quality pressings I worked at several small town AM stations were the records were in really bad shape, cue burns (scratches at the beginning of the song) fingerprints from slip cueing, scruffs. But we played them any way because the station didnt have the cash to replace them. Most of those old station turntables had heavy tone arms that would track through anything. And with AM's limited mono fidelity you couldnt hear the scratches. By the early 80's most music stations had moved to FM and had would record a new 45 onto cart (a tape cartridge that resembled an 8-track but played at a faster speed for higher fidelity) to play on the air. The worst company pressings from the 60's I have encountered are Mercury/Smash/Philips 45's - they are pressed on really cheap styrene and its hard to find a rare pressing in good shape. Now and then I have lucked out and found a mid 60's vinyl pressing on Mercury but they are very rare. Another bad one is Bell/Amy/Mala with those painted on (not paper) labels. If a record was played many times on a changer the label would wear right off. I think the worst 45 pressing I ever bought in the 1970's was Queen's "Somebody to Love" on Elektra. It was mastered at a low volume because it was a long song, and pressed on cheap styrene. Played on a cheap turntable the scratches would eventully overwhelm the music. Billy -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 2 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 23:38:05 +0100 From: Poul Nielsen Subject: Dennis Wilson LP title John wrote: > Does anyone know why The Searchers' 1965 hit "Goodbye My Love" > was bizarrely retitled "Goodbye My Lover Goodbye" for the American > market? Are there any other examples of song titles being changed > for no apparent reason? Hi there, I live in Denmark and am relatively new to this community. I remember having read that Dennis Wilson’s Pacific Ocean Blue LP originally was titled Pacific Ocean Blues with the album title being changed for no apparent reason just before the cover was printed. Can anybody confirm this? Poul -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 3 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 22:28:48 -0000 From: Glenn Subject: Re: Grass Roots Dan Hughes wrote: > Glenn, I enjoyed your Grass Roots site and I have a couple > of questions: > > 1. I saw the Grass Roots on the Lloyd Thaxton show (kind of > a west coast American Bandstand) when they were just starting, > and they performed Ballad of a Thin Man (which they called Mr. > Jones, I believe). I can't remember if they they also did Where > Were You When I Needed You. I don't think they did--I think they > had just released Mr. Jones. Do you have any record of this > appearance, and if Sloan and Barri were a part of that in-person > performance? > > 2. Sloan's voice is on the first album, but it was replaced for > the Where Were You single? I can't tell any difference, I don't > think. Can you? Dan, as far as 1): First, here's a list of Grass Roots TV appearances: It is by no means comprehensive, since I know of appearances by them on many other shows, such as "Rollin' On the River", "Playboy After Dark", "In Concert", "Solid Gold", the Wolfman Jack oldies show on TNN, and even "Good Morning America" (1983), where they sang a song for a projected second album on MCA that was never released! As for the Lloyd Thaxton show, it was not Sloan and Barri. Altho I have never personally spoken with P.F. Sloan, I did chat with him on AOL once, and he said that he and Steve never appeared as the Grass Roots. So it was probably the Bedouins, who had just taken on the Grass Roots name. There is no question on the timing of that- that the Bedouins were signed under the name "The Grass Roots" shortly before "Mr. Jones" was released as the first official Grass Roots single. As far as 2): My site claims to have a definitive version of the history of the vocals on WWYWINY. But that will have to be changed. Everyone seems to have a different version of the vocal presence(s) on this song and its different appearances, including Sloan himself, who says it is NOT his voice on the single. He claims it is Bill Fulton. Steve Barri has said that it IS Sloan. Joel Larson, the drummer of the Bedouins at the time, who later became a bona fide member (for the second time) of the Grass Roots with Rob Grill et al, says he was at the session where Bill Fulton's voice was dubbed over the already recorded version with Sloan's voice on it. Personally I can't hear any difference between the LP and single versions. On CD, the Grass Roots' Millenium Collection and Rhino's Anthology credit the versions on those CDs as by P.F. Sloan, and the Grass Roots All Time Greatest Hits CD credits its version as the Bill Fulton vocal. They sound identical to me. The only guarantee I can give you is that Sloan has never wavered on his claim that Bill Fulton's voice is on the single. I can also guarantee you that a version of WWYWINY with Sloan's voice on it was released only to radio stations in L.A., before the Bedouins ever came into the picture. If anyone can locate that extremely rare promo-only single, we might be able to answer this question for good. As far as the real answer to your question, it may be answered someday, but it won't be by me today. Glenn Golden Grass - The Grass Roots Fan Page -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 4 Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2004 00:10:05 -0000 From: Bob Celli Subject: Bobby Vee "Beautiful People" Austin Roberts: > Just to keep this string going, I was in a group called the > Arkade on Dunhill and we released Carole King's "Where You Lead" > at the same time you guys did; I think we helped cancel each other > out. Bummer. I think I'm right about that. Clark Besch: > How interesting that we have the two of you that had dueling 45s! > Both coming off moderate hits at about the same time! Reminds me > of many double releases that WERE hits still - Bobby Vee and > composer Kenny O'Dell's "Beautiful People" is one I always felt > would have been top 10, had only one of these two top 40 hits been > released. Clark, I did an interview with Bobby Vee's producer at that time, Dallas Smith, and he told me that "Beautiful People" sold 750,000, so your statement couldn't be truer! Bob Celli -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 5 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 21:28:33 -0000 From: Guy Lawrence Subject: Re. William Shatner "platch1" wrote: > My father, Don Ralke, was the arranger/conductor of > "The Transformed Man". The album was recorded in all > seriousness. The musical arrangements are lush and could > stand alone. Wow. I was just about to put finger to keyboard to add to the Shatner thread when this message appeared. I was about to point out the very same thing - sure, Captain Kirk hamming it up is hilarious but listen to that gorgeous arrangement of "Tambourine Man" (especially the wonderful banjo part) and you'll here a thing of great beauty. When the album got reissued by Revola in the Nineties this track would often be dug out to raise a few laughs but I was always struck by that heavenly arrangement and it's remained a favourite of mine since. I didn't know until now that it was the work of Don Ralke but that would explain a lot - his production and arrangement work with the Sunrays turned out some absolutely gorgeous records and his many other triumphs have been discussed here before. Guy -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 6 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 21:24:09 -0000 From: Glenn Subject: Re: Bi question I wrote: > a lot of people don't realize that the mystery of the gender of > the song's subject finally IS answered in the song: > "Well I'm not the world's most masculine man > But I know what I am and I'm glad I'm a man > And so is Lola... Rat Pfink: > Nope, the question of gender isn't answered at all. Ray Davies' > lyrics are ambiguous enough that "And so is Lola" can be > interpreted either as 1) Lola is also a man -or- 2) Lola is > also glad he's a man. I both saw the second interpretation and anticipated a disputing answer, and I have to say that to some degree I agree with you. Yet, when you HEAR Davies sing the line, and realize it is his final word on the subject - it is the very last line in a song about gender confusion about Lola, it FEELS to me that he is making a final declaration about the true sex of the subject. Sometimes the way a line is sung says more about its content than the words alone. I can see your point of view, yet I will stick with my gut feeling that Davies is saying that Lola IS a man. But he is a very clever songwriter, and there's a high probability that the ambiguity was on purpose. He's also a good singer, and there's a good chance that the way the final three words sound "slipped in" is indicative of someone trying to "get away" with something naughty on the radio. A kind of "wink wink" to the listeners. Many of whom don't seem to even catch the first two of those last three words anyway. Phil Milstein wrote: > I think The Sweet's "AC/DC" fits the bill. Good one! A great Chinnichap song, also fairly controversial - and even innovative - for its time, and one of many strong arguments against Mike Chapman's obnoxious assertions that Nicky Chinn was a bad lyricist. If you haven't read any interviews with Chapman since he and Chinn split up, do yourself a favor and DON'T. Especially if you're a Chinn & Chapman fan, which I happen to be. Glenn -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 7 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 16:14:58 EST From: Austin Roberts Subject: Re: Medicine Man / Buchanan bros Bobster, I hope you saw the email I wrote about taking Gene Pistilli's place as lead singer of the Buchannan Bros. Gene Pistilli did the great lead on Medicine Man then left the group and they asked me to take his place. Sorry for the confusion. Austin -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 8 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 16:09:35 EST From: Austin Roberts Subject: Re: Speaking of the Knickerbockers and the Righteous Bros... Was it Grapefruit that did Maybe Tomorrow? Austin R. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 9 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 15:44:47 EST From: Austin Roberts Subject: Re: Lambert-Potter productions / Magpie Stump?? / Arkade I honestly don't know about Magpie Stump. I do know that they used our Arkade version of The Morning Of Our Lives for several years as the Bridal Fair theme. Best, Austin Roberts -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 10 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 15:38:06 EST From: Austin Roberts Subject: Re: The Buchanan Bros / Medicine Man Clark, Sorry to mislead anyone. I had originally answered someone that I took Gene Pistilli's place after he left the Buchannan Bros. Then someone asked some of the other Ghost voices I did and the Buchannan Bros. was one of them. Gene, who is still a good friend, sang lead on Medicine Man. Sorry for the mix up. Austin -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 11 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 15:35:46 -0500 From: Roger Smith Subject: Re: The Transformed Shatner William Shatner: > "When a cut is played without any context you'll be puzzled by > what I'm doing, but my hope is that you'll know what I'm doing > if you listen to the whole record" (c.1998). > Ah! That decides it then. Thanks. > I guess to be fair to Mr. Shatner, I would have to listen to the > whole album to get the context. But it is hard to imagine what > context would make the two cuts I heard sound anything but > ludicrous! Someone once said that you don't have to eat an entire egg to know it's rotten. If Shatner admitted the album was a joke, it wouldn't be quite as funny. So whether or not he was serious when recording it, I think it's best that he continues to defend it! -- Roger -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 12 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 19:07:29 -0000 From: Martin Roberts Subject: Jack Nitzsche at Spectropop update. The Cooperstown Volunteer Band are blasting away as the Record Of The Week on the home page: The battle for the next ROTW is between two previous winners' b-sides. The vocalists are Dick Lory or Billy Daniels. The Discography page has been updated: Jingle #10, Folk-Rock, is playing On The Radio: Thanks for the responses to the site's questionnaire. To show I do read the comments, a menu has been added at the top of most pages. Martin -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 13 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 13:24:28 -0800 (GMT-08:00) From: Chris Subject: Alien Encounters Rodney Rawlings: > "Send in the Clowns" was of course by Stephen Sondheim, > who in my view is not a good melodist. "De gustibus non disputandum est", as we used to say during recess in third grade. But have you listened to the Pet Shop Boys/Liza Minnelli version of Sondheim's "Losing My Mind"? A good version of a good -- and melodic -- song. Chris "Nihil Spectropop Mihi Alienum Est" P.S. For the record, I'll also point to the title song of "Anyone Can Whistle" and "One More Kiss" from "Follies" as examples of Sondheim The Melodist. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 14 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 23:02:58 -0000 From: Rodney Rawlings Subject: Re: William Shatner I did notice that the two cuts I heard were nicely arranged. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 15 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 18:07:03 -0500 From: Country Paul Subject: Pre-Band, wherefore Superman?; stereo Smash (and Merc and Philips); running a'Fowley Stephane Rebeschini: > Hi - The first single of "The Band" was released by > "Robertson/Danko/Manuel/Hudson/Helm", this was before > "The Band" became the group's name. "Music From Big Pink" > was the name of their first LP. You can find everything > you need to know (and much more!) about the Band there: > Ah, Stephane - this is why it takes so long to catch up with S'pop - prolific writing and incredible websites! One of my favorite 45's is Ronnie Hawkins and the Band's "Bo Diddley"/"Who Do You Love" (1963) which sounds like it would have been recorded several years later. There's also a really cool track, "Come Love", on the Ronnie Hawkins album with the above two tracks, featuring Robbie Robertson doing some blues-rock guitar playing just on the edge of feedback that was also years "ahead of schedule". And then there's Levon & The Hawks' "He Don't Love You", a superb record which presages the Band's later rock style. But all these other tracks - it'll be a nice hour of listening! THANK YOU! Mark T: > Two compilations of White Whale rarities and why does neither > one have the single by Christmas Spirit which is The Turtles > and a young Linda Ronstadt? That's maybe the priciest and > rarest 45 in the catalogue. But does any of them have the Clique's "Superman" Billy G. Spradlin: > Then on LP, you had the reverse of this phenomenon -- at least > with The Left Banke and some other Mercury/Smash acts. I have > a copy of the "Walk Away Renée/Pretty Ballerina" album that > says mono on the label and the jacket but that in fact plays > stereo. I'm not sure if this album was ever actually issued in > mono or not, and it's my understanding that this was the case > with several other releases at this time when "playable on mono > phonographs" stereo LPs first came out. In the mid 60s, the Mercury-Smash-Philips labels did this for probably a couple of years. I was doing country radio at the time and all the promo LP's they shipped were stereo, no matter what the sleeve said. Phil Milstein's review of the new Kim Fowley comp,, makes me want to run right out and order it! Good writing, Phil. Looking over the "S'pop Recommends" pages, it's interesting how many CDs and books this group has steered me to. Compliments to all. Whew! Made it up to 2004 - we've certainly become a prolific cohort, haven't we?!? "Talk, talk", Country Paul -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 16 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 18:24:16 EST From: Austin Roberts Subject: Re: Adam & Eve Buzz Cason is one of my closest friends (in Nashville), so tell me what you want to know and I'll ask him for you. Austin Roberts -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 17 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 15:42:14 -0800 (GMT-08:00) From: Chris Subject: Words & Melodies, Melodies & Words Steve Harvey wrote: > Lyrics are icing on the cake (the melody). How many people have > bought a song because it had great lyrics, but a lousy tune. You're > more likely to hear somebody humming a melody than quoting a lyric. > Don't get me wrong, great lyrics can lift a great melody to even > greater height, but can the reverse be said to be true? Well, we won't talk about Bob Dylan, will we? But I do think that there's a case for describing Leiber & Stoller (whom I revere) as being better at lyrics than the creation of melodies. One other, stodgier example of a song whose chief virtue is its lyrics: "It's The Talk of the Town" by Marty Symes, Al J. Neiburg, and Jerry Livingston. Chris (who just acquired a song, "My Other Me," because of its words by E.Y. Harburg) -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 18 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 00:00:59 -0000 From: Fred Clemens Subject: Re: Answer Songs Phil Hall wrote: > One of my favorite musical subjects is answer songs. There was a 1997 CD called THOSE DOO WOPP ANSWER SONGS on Silly Records CD SR 8011. Some oddball ones NOT included: "Knock Down The Door" the Takeoffs (Ford) Jay and the Americans "Let's Lock The Door" "Stop It Little Girl" the Octobers (Chairman) the Shirelles "Foolish Little Girl" "Tell Tommy I Miss Him" Marilyn Michaels (RCA Victor) Ray Peterson's "Tell Laura I Love Her" Fred Clemens -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 19 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 00:01:35 -0000 From: Mark Frumento Subject: Re: Speaking Of Apple Records... David Coyle wrote: > I just got the new RPM disc "94 Baker St.: The > Pop-Psych Era Of Apple Records 1967-69" and it's > really good. David - I couldn't agree more. The CD shows just how diverse the Apple organization was. And to me the McCartney produced Grapefruit sounds better than the heavily orchestrated Terry Melcher recordings. I aslo agree that the Iveys tracks are worth the price alone. Amazing that some of this stuff hadn't leaked out before (aside from those that got official release). Where did you hear about the licensing issues with the Misunderstood tracks? My CD has those tracks and I assumed that the faulty copies were a problem at the plant or a bad index on the CD. Though it's old news to some "Those Were the Days" by Stefan Granados (who also compiled the CD) is a great book about Apple. It's one of my favorite music books in recent mememory. Wonderful insite into the Beatles organization without getting too carried away with the Beatles as a topic... and fortunately without the distorted view of the Beatles themselves. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 20 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 16:02:03 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Harvey Subject: Re: Answer Songs How about the lofty, delicate "Suzanne" by Leonard Cohen followed by the sleezeball stalker (Randy Newman) calls up "Sue" after reading what Leonard had written "in a telephone booth"? -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 21 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 00:16:25 -0000 From: Mark Frumento Subject: Re: Badfinger and a pino colada, my friend Country Paul wrote: > And, to Mark Frumento, Badfinger *did* sell a bunch > of records. I'm not familiar with the Rockin' Horse LP you cite, > but I remember Sleepy Hollow and Stackridge as being like third- > and second-rate Beatles derivatives, respectively. However, it's > been since their release that I've heard them; time could make > my opinions kinder. Is there space on musica to which you could > post a favorite Stackridge track? Paul, you really must warn me when I get named in one of your messages. I also missed it!! ;>)) Don't think I ever disputed that Badfinger sold records... probably got the wrong Mark. There's a lot of us around here these days. I did dispute that Pete Ham sounds like McCartney. Sleepy Hollow is second rate Beatles, but that's a good thing. Most bands aren't 5th rate Beatles. Stackridge really has very little to do with the Beatles. James Warren is clearly fixated on the band and has been to a degree influenced by them. Other than that they shared George Martin as producer on one LP. I brought Stackridge up with regard to the original question of early 60s sound revival. If/when there's room I'll post a track from 'Man in the Bowler Hat' which sadly is out of print now. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 22 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 19:56:55 EST From: Bob Rashkow Subject: How Sweet It Is WLS Clark: >if you see the movie, the lyrics work better in your mind also. I didn't even have to see the movie. I was 12 when Picardy's breathtaking version debuted on WCFL and just as quickly vanished from the airwaves. The record flew me away on a rainbow of love. Many years later, I saw the movie. Except for a couple of scenes, I found it rather silly......but you're right, Clark, about the title theme, it's terrific. I never knew "Picardy" also recorded this, but I own the Dunhill single now and would like to get the one other 45 these people did, 05 :30 Plane. Also a Webb song? Bobster -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 23 Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2004 16:06:15 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Harvey Subject: Re: Happy Christmas was a race horse As Mr. Spector once remarked to John Lennon, Happy Xmas bears more than a little resemblance to I Love How You Love Me. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 24 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 01:38:05 GMT From: Mark Subject: Left Banke's '70s LP Hey Guys! The album with "Queen of Paradise" is entitled "Strangers on a Train", and it came out on the Relix label. I think I played it once, and probably should play it again! (I also have the Camerica single). I have to dig out the LP (most of my records are scattered around the house), so I can't post a track list at present. Best, Mark -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 25 Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2004 01:52:20 -0000 From: Michael Edwards Subject: Goodbye My Love John Love asks: >Does anyone know why The Searchers' 1965 hit "Goodbye My Love" >was bizarrely retitled "Goodbye My Lover Goodbye" for the American >market? Are there any other examples of song titles being changed >for no apparent reason? It may have been because it was an American song (originally recorded by Jimmy Hughes on Fame in 1964). One of the song's composers, Robert Mosely, also penned "Sha La La" for the Shirelles and Manfred Mann. And talking of the Manfreds and changing song titles, they added an extra "Diddy" to "Do Wah Diddy" by the Exciters to create "Do Wah Diddy Diddy" Mike -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
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