The Spectropop Group Archives presented by Friends of Spectropop

[Prev by Date] [Next by Date] [Index] [Search]

Spectropop - Digest Number 1181

               SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop!

There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

      1. A Moderators'  Plea
           From: S'pop Team 
      2. Re: The Ventures
           From: John Fox 
      3. Re: Bad Lines
           From: Scott Charbonneau 
      4. Re: Orpheus
           From: Orion 
      5. Re: Bad Lines
           From: Paul Bryant 
      6. Re: Talk about
           From: Patrick Rands 
      7. Re: Best Lines
           From: Tom Taber 
      8. Re: Aldon Music Staffers
           From: Joe Nelson 
      9. Re: Da da-da da
           From: Jon Adelson 
     10. Re: The Ventures
           From: Paul Bryant 
     11. Re: Bad Lines
           From: S.J. Dibai 
     12. The Fleetwoods
           From: Julio Nino 
     13. Re: Jerry Yester
           From: Kevin 
     14. Re: Orpheus
           From: Art Longmire 
     15. Monty Babson
           From: David Bell 
     16. Re: Bad rhymes/bad grammar
           From: Clay S. 
     17. Christmas with Dusty (and Rod)
           From: David A Young 
     18. Re: The Ventures
           From: Steve Harvey 
     19. Re: "The Long Black Veil"
           From: Steve Harvey 
     20. Tupper Saussy photo in photo section
           From: Nick Archer 
     21. Re: Spector / Spoonful connection
           From: Steve Harvey 
     22. Re: Goodbye Girl
           From: S.J. Dibai 
     23. cleaned up lyrics
           From: Phil Chapman 
     24. Re: The two Dolphin labels
           From: Andrew Jones 
     25. Re: Tupper Saussy photo in photo section
           From: Jeff Lemlich 

Message: 1 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:58:25 -0000 From: S'pop Team Subject: A Moderators' Plea Dear Members, Do spare a thought for your over-worked moderators during this period of feverish activity here at the S'pop Discussion Forum. Each message takes at least two minutes for a moderator to process. At an average of over 40 messages a day, that adds up to a lot of time. Remember that your moderators are all unpaid volunteers. Here are a few simple ways you could make their work a little less time-consuming: 1) Always, always put your name at the end of your message. 2) When responding to a message, please do not quote the entire message to which you are replying. A few lines, quoted at the beginning, along with the name of the person that posted the message, are all that's required. 3) Please put the subject in the message header. Simply noting 'Digest Number xxxx' requires the moderator to search through an entire digest to establish the subject of the reply. 4) You've seen the neat style in which S'pop messages are presented. Please try to submit your messages in that same style. We thank you. The S'pop Team -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 2 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 11:38:29 EST From: John Fox Subject: Re: The Ventures Previously: Were they - what's the phrase - big in Japan?? In a word, yes. One of the first great live albums is "The Ventures on Stage", recorded in Japan around 1964 (which as I recall is one of those classic short albums we were discussing a few weeks ago--maybe 12 2-minute songs). Also classic are the Japanese announcer's introduction of the band, and a bit where I believe he tries to find something in their equipment that's made in Japan and can only come up with a cord. I just checked and there is a compilation CD with 29 songs on it, all recorded live in Japan, for $16.95. It even includes a version of "When You Walk In The Room" (which seems to be becoming the patron saint song of Spectropop). Here's a link to the album: John Fox -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 3 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 15:52:50 -0000 From: Scott Charbonneau Subject: Re: Bad Lines Another gem from Dylan, this one from "Million Dollar Bash": I looked at my watch, I looked at my wrist I punched myself in the face with my fist. Gets me cracking up every time. Scott -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 4 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 12:57:36 -0500 From: Orion Subject: Re: Orpheus The Orpheus Compilations that are out are great and it really helps to point out how some groups, regardless of talent, were never allowed to shine. The Big Beat version though, which you can still find, is the best, encompassing two CDs. I have it and it is definitely one of the few CDs I would not part with. Orion -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 5 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 07:34:17 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Bryant Subject: Re: Bad Lines duojet wrote: > Ah, you forgot Sonny's classic solo album "Inner Views" > and the magnum opus "I Just Sit There", which contains > the fantastic line: > "Your sister's still a virgin, your mother's cooking sturgeon" Wow, after that one I just sit there too, stunned pb -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 6 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 18:00:27 -0000 From: Patrick Rands Subject: Re: Talk about Julio Niño wrote: > I've been listening this afternoon to some tracks sung in > English by Mina..........."Il cielo..." is a perfect song, > composed by the ultracool Gino Paoli (whose version of the > song, arranged and conducted by Ennio Morricone, is so > beautiful that it's scary). Hi Julio, I can't help you out with your Mina question, but I do agree that Gino Paoli's version of "Il cielo in una stanza" is astounding. I played that and many other great songs this past May on a 1960s Italian music spotlight radio show, the tracklisting can be found here: :Patrick -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 7 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 06:28:44 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Taber Subject: Re: Best Lines Bob Hanes wrote: > The Lovin Spoonful- "and ran out the doo(r)flambeau" I've always been fond of lyrics that are fun to sing. A woman once told me "there is a very thin line between the highly erotic, and the totally gross", and I think the same applies to best/worst song lyrics. The "isn't him too" line from the Ronettes has to be one of my favorites - maybe because as a country boy it sounded so urban and ethnic to my ears. Favorite line I ever wrote: "He mopes and moans and ya-da-ya-da, The letter smells like Camp Granada" Tom Taber -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 8 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 12:42:59 -0500 From: Joe Nelson Subject: Re: Aldon Music Staffers Mikey wrote: >Don't forget Koppelman and Rubin (3 O'Clock Rock). K&R wrote for Aldon? I know when they got into music publishing they named a company Chardon (after their names CHARles Koppelman and DONald Rubin - much as Aldon was named after AL Nevins and DON Kirshner). I wasn't aware of an Aldon connection, but in this context it stands not only as inspiration from the bosses, but as a tribute as well. Joe Nelson -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 9 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 19:23:26 -0000 From: Jon Adelson Subject: Re: Da da-da da Rashkowsky wrote: >> ...for all the honest world to feel. > > OK Adelson--what song are the last 7 words from, huh? Unfortunately, my mind is suffering acute inertia trying to identify the Da da-da da song (aka the do me-so fa song). I was about to dive into Google when I read your admonition about playing fair. Thus, I admit I didn't have a clue until Dan Hughes' post. Actually, it sounds like a coke commercial to me. "I'd like to teach the world to sing, so all of us can heal, to share the joy of Coke for all, the honest world to feel." (Sorry, no one can use this as a "worst lyric/rhyme" - admin. says keep it to 60s songs :-) ) Dan Hughes wrote: > Love that song but don't understand it. Pancho Villa? > Lefty Frizzell? Pancho Sanza? Lefty Gomez? Pancho and Cisco? > Huh? Ah, of course..."Frizzell and Gomez" (I've waited for this moment) ra ta tat Jon Adelson -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 10 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 12:39:46 -0800 (PST) From: Paul Bryant Subject: Re: The Ventures Mikey wrote: > What people forget is that The Ventures had a whopping 17 > charted singles from 1960 to 1970...yet they are known in > the business as album sellers. Whew! I'm impressed. However, my Billboard Book of Top 40 hits gives a measly 6 hits to the Ventures, commencing with "Walk Don't Run" in 1960, and ending with "Hawaii-Five-O" in 1969. When you say they had 17 charted singles, what are you actually referring to? pb -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 11 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:03:33 -0000 From: S.J. Dibai Subject: Re: Bad Lines I can think of a few grammatical atrocities in '60s music. How about The New Colony Six's "I Confess"? "I confess to have a willingness and wanting for you/To have you here by me and here by me all my life through." That has to be one of the most disjointed, most poorly worded couplets I've ever heard. Chad and Jeremy's "Before and After", written by Van McCoy: "I used to be happy as he, 'til I lost you somehow/ Though I don't show it, you wouldn't know it to look at me now." Huh? "Though I don't show it, you wouldn't know it"??? Wouldn't the girl to whom the narrator is singing not know "it" *because* he doesn't show "it"? And there's C&J's self-composed "Why Should I Care", which includes the line "Everybody knows about you, the way you treated me bad"--or at least that's how it's listed on C&J's official website. But really, they sing, "Everybody knows about you way you treated me bad"! They sang it that way to fit it into the melody, but they could just as easily have said, "Everybody knows about THE way you treated me bad." (Yes, I know it should be "badly".) The Magnificent Men, "Peace Of Mind", in which I *think* the lead singer says "All the things that are rougher come, I got tougher from." Shudder. Let's not forget The Easybeats. One of their primary songwriters was originally from a non-English speaking country (Holland), but he was writing with a native speaker of the language, so there was no excuse for lines like these: "Now the people remember me as being a genius, but compare their clamoring to hear what I will say/It's so funny they carry me away." (from "The Music Goes 'Round My Head") I could go on forever listing grammatical quirks in The Easybeats' songs, but in a sense, those quriks make their material distinctive. And then there's one songwriting device I simply cannot stand: switching from second person to third person (or vice versa) when you're talking about the same individual! Many good songs have been hurt by this, especially Del Shannon's "Runaway," and Gene Pitney's "She's A Heartbreaker" (which was written by Swamp Dogg and Charlie Foxx). If I think of more examples, I'll bring them up. S.J. Dibai -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 12 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:58:17 -0000 From: Julio Nino Subject: The Fleetwoods Hi Everybody, Bill Craig asked: > Were The Fleetwoods ever on Dolphin?... Bill, Yes, at first the Fleedwoods were on Dolphin Records, but it wasn't the same as John Dolphin's '50s label. Then their label changed its name to Dolton. "Come Softly To Me" exists on both labels. Julio Nino -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 13 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 13:21:30 -0800 (PST) From: Kevin Subject: Re: Jerry Yester Alan Zweig said: > "Farewell Aldebaran", a very good record. Recently > played a bit by Bob Brainen on WFMU, and searchable. A truly great psych-folk masterpiece, and one of the greatest LPs never made available on CD (as yet). Evidently there's some copyright problems and/or bad blood between the folks at Zappa's Straight label and the (demi)gods at WEA. Still 'n' such...if anyone has this and can play "St. Nicholas Hall" to musica, I for one would be 4ever gr8ful. kjm in la -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 14 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 21:21:35 -0000 From: Art Longmire Subject: Re: Orpheus C Ponti wrote: > As rabid a fan as I am, their version is awful and self-indulgent. Tom wrote: > I really have to disagree with your comments regarding Orpheus' > outstanding cover of "Walk Away Renee". I just listened to it > again and am as captivated as I was when I first heard it. Well, I must say I'm getting a load of information on Orpheus's "Walk Away Renee"! I have a feeling I would like it...and these competing descriptions have me even more curious to hear their version. Regarding the Left Banke's original, I have to say it is one of my all-time favorite songs-love the strings, love Steve Martin's vocals, this is one of the songs that got me into music as a boy. To me it's musical perfection. I think the only cover version I can remember hearing is the Four Top's version from '67 or '68 - I have the 45 and I think that Levi Stubbs gives the song a more mature feel that also suits it very well. But the Left Banke's original is definitive, in my opinion. Art Longmire -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 15 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 16:51:50 EST From: David Bell Subject: Monty Babson I was delighted to read the name Monty Babson, as it has given me the chance to bring up the name Sue Holliday aka Susan Singer again. Any chance to do so and I will. Monty was Su's recording manager and produced a great album for her in the Lansdowne Series on the British Columbia label. It's a collection of 10 jazz songs and is just superb. Songs like Take the A Train, Happy Talk, Don't Get Around Much Anymore and Dark Streets On Sunday are featured. I think I must be the only Susan Singer / Su Holliday fan in the world and there has never been a whisper of a release on CD of any of her material. One day..... David. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 16 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 23:01:50 -0000 From: Clay S. Subject: Re: Bad rhymes/bad grammar I wrote: > I been a rambler and a gambler > And I guess I always will" > -- "Heard It in a Love Song," Marshall Tucker Band > ("will" what? There's no antecedent for this verb!) Mike McKay : > I realized upon further reflection (and checking a lyric site > to confirm it) that it's actually even worse than this. The > complete couplet is: > "Always something greener on the other side of that hill > I was born a wrangler and a rambler and I guess I always will" > So there isn't even a "been" to play off of! Now it makes sense! "I was born a wrangler and a rambler and I guess I always will" (wrangle and ramble) Clay S. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 17 Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:56:31 -0000 From: David A Young Subject: Christmas with Dusty (and Rod) First, for context, a quick recap of information previously shared here: Rod McKuen had Dusty Springfield as his guest on a TV special entitled "Christmas in New England". Their duet of "Baby, It's Cold Outside" from the show was issued on his Laserlight label on a CD called "Christmas in London"; when I attempted to order the disc from his Web site, I found that it wasn't available, but that a VHS video of the special was, so I ordered that instead. Having viewed it now a couple of times, I thought list members might be interested in a brief report on the video, so here's my mini-review: The other guests are the St. Paul's Boys Choir at Cambridge. Given that the show was filmed in 1978 and stars Rod McKuen, it probably goes without saying that it's hokey as hell, with our girl Dusty doing her damndest to rise above the cheesy surroundings, She makes her entrance about 2.5 minutes into the show, joining Rod for a forgettable medley of traditional Christmas carols. They next duet on what I'm guessing to be a McKuen original, called "So My Sheep May Safely Graze". (The blink-and-you'll-miss- them end credits don't include information about any of the songs.) This is followed by the aforementioned "Baby, It's Cold Outside", and both performances are respectable. Where Dusty truly shines is the segment in which she sings another song I'd not heard before. It's called "Simple Gifts", but has nothing in common with the Shaker hymn by the same name; again, I presume it's an R McK composition. The song and the sentiments it conveys are really quite lovely, but, inexplicably, Rod interrupts La Springfield with some banter after the penultimate phrase. Clearly displeased, she scolds, "Don't ruin this!" before finishing the song. Damn shame that. Her other solo spotlight consists of her quite self-consciously lip-synching to the title song from her then-current album "Living Without Your Love" while disco-ing down alone on the cramped and corny set. Poor dear. She's back on once more to join Rod (and, this time, the boychoir) on another round of seasonal chestnuts, but as before, her contribution is negligible. Still, I've regretted other $10 purchases much more than this one and find it easy to enjoy as a period piece. If not for McKuen's unwelcome interjection toward the end of the one song, it'd be easy to argue that it justified the purchase price of the video. It certainly leaves me wishing that a studio version of the tune (with Mr McKuen nowhere near the studio) existed. Now you know. David -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 18 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 18:04:29 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Harvey Subject: Re: The Ventures John Berg wrote: > I was sorry I had disdained them back in the > mid-to-late '60s as "square". And they served as an important link in rock and roll by releasing their instructional records, "Ventures Play Guitar". A lot of name musicians, at least in the US, have sited those records as starting points for their careers. It would be nice to see some of the stars of today following in that tradition. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 19 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 17:57:35 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Harvey Subject: Re: "The Long Black Veil" Glad to see somebody else thought this damn tune ["The Long Black Veil"] was a little far-fetched. Maybe somebody should write a sequel where the best friend tops the singer and gets hung instead. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 20 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:51:11 -0600 From: Nick Archer Subject: Tupper Saussy photo in photo section Tupper Saussy was in Nashville from California last Friday night to open an exhibit of his paintings. I posted a photo in the photo section. Left to right, it's my friend Skip Woolwine, Tupper Saussy, and John "Buck" Wilkins, lead singer of Ronnie & the Daytonas, and writer of "Little GTO". Nick Archer Nashville TN Check out Nashville's classic radio station SM95 on the web at -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 21 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 18:34:06 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Harvey Subject: Re: Spector / Spoonful connection Hey, I knew, but then the Spoons were my favorite band. I seem to recall something about Phil sitting in on piano at the gig. In 1967 I made my first trip to the Village to see my aunt's new place there. Visited the Night Owl which was still a club at that time. Hung around all day and went to see the show that night. While I'm watching it who should come in, but all, but one of the Turtles ('cept Howard). They were riding high at the time with some tune by That Alan Gordon. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 22 Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2003 20:10:14 -0000 From: S.J. Dibai Subject: Re: Goodbye Girl Stuart Miller wrote: > The discussion around "Goodbye Girl" was, was Frankie Valli > singing to his daughter or to his girlfriend? As I recall, > the general consensus at the time was that he was "speaking" > to his daughter but none of us could really be sure. The closing > line, "Daddy's gone" didn't help either. Stuart, Jeez, I always thought he was singing to his girlfriend. It never even occurred to me that he was singing to his daughter. The use of terms such as "little girl" was not uncommon to refer to one's girlfriend in '60s pop music, nor was the use of the term "daddy" to refer to one's boyfriend. And I figured the reason it was on the flip of "Saturday's Father" is that they needed a B-side and that track was sitting around on an LP--furthermore, Bob Crewe co-wrote it, and it seems like that was enough to get a 4 Seasons song released on a 45. Of course, the line, "All you life you've had to pay for my mistakes" does imply that it is indeed his daughter that Frankie Valli is singing to. And in that context, it eerily foreshadows a line from "A New Beginning": "Does the baby cry for all my sinning?" S.J. Dibai -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 23 Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 01:02:16 -0000 From: Phil Chapman Subject: cleaned up lyrics Paul Bryant: > One night of sin is what I'm now paying for. > and for the pop single version that was cleaned up: > One night with you is what I'm now praying for. A similar example of lyric de-cleansing comes from S'pop fave, Ellie Greenwich, on "I'll Never Need More Than This". The highly-charged Tina Turner sings: Oh I love what you do to me Thrills of love are going through me Whereas cha cha charming Ellie is more explicit: Oh I love the way you do me Thrills of love are going through me mother was *not* pleased :-) Phil -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 24 Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 00:49:07 -0500 (EST) From: Andrew Jones Subject: Re: The two Dolphin labels The Dolphin Records label that released "Come Softly to Me" by the Fleetwoods is the same label that became Dolton - John Dolphin had nothing to do with it. Dolphin Records was founded by one Bob Reisdorff in Washington state; after he released "Come Softly to Me," he learned there was already a Dolphin label (maybe John Dolphin was involved in THAT one?), so he changed his label's name to Dolton after "CSTM" ran its course. -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
Message: 25 Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 05:58:53 -0000 From: Jeff Lemlich Subject: Re: Tupper Saussy photo in photo section Nick Archer: > Tupper Saussy was in Nashville from California last Friday > night to open an exhibit of his paintings. I posted a photo > in the photo section. Left to right, it's my friend Skip > Woolwine, Tupper Saussy, and John "Buck" Wilkins, lead singer > of Ronnie & the Daytonas, and writer of "Little GTO". Thanks for posting that, Nick. I wonder if drummer Jerry Carrigan was there (as the common link between Ronny & The Daytonas and the Neon Philharmonic). Jeff Lemlich -------------------[ archived by Spectropop ]-------------------
SPECTROPOP - Spectacular! Retro! Pop! End

Click here to go to The Spectropop Group
Spectropop text contents © copyright 2002 Spectropop unless stated otherwise. All rights in and to the contents of these documents, including each element embodied therein, is subject to copyright protection under international copyright law. Any use, reuse, reproduction and/or adaptation without written permission of the owners is a violation of copyright law and is strictly prohibited. All rights reserved.